Who’s the most beloved athlete in your state?

dbldwn711 said:
wanna know what I think is “Ironic“? You whining about steroid usage in regards to a game played in 2013. Like this one from the World Series. Cue Mr Big Time…




As they said in that clip… Ortiz was the FIRST lefty all season to take that pitcher deep. He faced 84 lefties that year and none of them hit a homer but Ortiz does it in the World Series… like I said… Mr Big Time is here. 😂
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I think roids should be encouraged if not mandatory, but don’t crucify some and let others off the hook. Bonds was undoubtedly a better player, even had a glove. Both used roids. One is hated and the other is loved. End the double standard
 
Illustrious Potentate said:
I think roids should be encouraged if not mandatory, but don’t crucify some and let others off the hook. Bonds was undoubtedly a better player, even had a glove. Both used roids. One is hated and the other is loved. End the double standard
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one used roids his entire career and one did not. One is a great leader and other is not. One is a great clutch hitter (Arguably the greatest clutch hitter of all time) while the other is not. Hey, maybe Ortiz took special roids? Maybe the ones he took worked better in clutch pressure packed moments?! While you’re whining and trying to figure that one out (And in the process you’ll realize that there’s no “Double standard”) why not enjoy another clutch moment from the non-steroid era of 2013. Cue Mr Big Time… again…

 
dbldwn711 said:
one used roids his entire career and one did not. One is a great leader and other is not. One is a great clutch hitter (Arguably the greatest clutch hitter of all time) while the other is not. Hey, maybe Ortiz took special roids? Maybe the ones he took worked better in clutch pressure packed moments?! While you’re whining and trying to figure that one out (And in the process you’ll realize that there’s no “Double standard”) why not enjoy another clutch moment from the non-steroid era of 2013. Cue Mr Big Time… again…

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Bonds wasn’t on roids his whole career, he started somewhere around 97-98.

Both “cheated”. Both need to be treated the same
 
RubinRock said:
Being a divided college state, most beloved may also be most hated. Until the whole scandal ordeal, I would have said it was a toss up between Deshaun and like Marcus Lattimore/Connor Shaw. Its a state school and theres a lot of dipshits here, so I'm probably going with Connor Shaw/Marcus Lattimore.


Honorable mention: Justin Fields
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Yeah I believe it’s Marcus Lattimore. Big time recruit from SC and after all he been through with injuries, I think most at that point wishes the guy well
 
MLB - Miguel Cabrera, Trammell and Whitaker, Willie Horton - RIP Al Kaline and Hank Greenberg

NFL - Barry Sanders & Calvin Johnson - RIP Bobby Layne

NHL - Steve Yzermann & Russian Five - RIP Gordie Howe

NBA - Joe Dumars & The Bad Boys, Magic Johnson, Fab Five
 
This is so hard for PA because of how much each side of the state hates the other.

I guess active McCutchen since he's played for both the Pirates and Phillies. Clemente all-time because he gets universal respect, and Wilt for being an all-time great and no one west of State College giving a shit about the NBA enough to drag the 76ers down. Lemieux getting a standing ovation in Philly coming back from cancer is about as close as you'll ever get to anything other than pure hatred when it comes to hockey. Probably a toss-up between Bednarik and Joe Greene for football.
 
dbldwn711 said:
one used roids his entire career and one did not. One is a great leader and other is not. One is a great clutch hitter (Arguably the greatest clutch hitter of all time) while the other is not. Hey, maybe Ortiz took special roids? Maybe the ones he took worked better in clutch pressure packed moments?! While you’re whining and trying to figure that one out (And in the process you’ll realize that there’s no “Double standard”) why not enjoy another clutch moment from the non-steroid era of 2013. Cue Mr Big Time… again…

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That simply isn’t true. Bonds had a HOF career before he started juicing. Ortiz was a light hitter who never hit more than 20 HR in his first six seasons in the MLB. Then he goes to Boston and has a “miraculous“ power surge that lasted the rest of his career. You also don’t know that he stopped after the time he was caught. You only know he didn’t get caught again.
 
williewilliejuan said:
That simply isn’t true. Bonds had a HOF career before he started juicing. Ortiz was a light hitter who never hit more than 20 HR in his first six seasons in the MLB. Then he goes to Boston and has a “miraculous“ power surge that lasted the rest of his career. You also don’t know that he stopped after the time he was caught. You only know he didn’t get caught again.
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I know baseball was testing for it much much more after 2004. You think he eluded all those tests for a decade?

have you seen the video of Ortiz hitting moon shots when he was a nobody in the Dominican league? Arod and Griffey jr challenged anyone to a HR hitting contest and an unknown Ortiz crushed them both but according to you he WASNT juicing then.

When Ortiz got released from the twins organization several baseball people went crazy telling the organization they just cut their best hitter. Even in Boston Ortiz was buried on the depth chart till he got his chance. When he did he never looked back. To be a hitter you’ve gotta get significant ABs. Ortiz finally got them in Boston.

Ortiz has 3 WS rings. He was a major part of all three of them. He may have been the biggest part. Bonds has ZERO championships. He was barely called upon to perform in the clutch bc he was almost never in the clutch. Nobody thinks of him as a “leader” because he isn’t one. He’s a “me” guy. Bonds was always stand-offish with the press. That’s why Ortiz is “loved” and bonds isn’t. @Illustrious Potentate trying to call it a “double standard” bc of steroid use is horseshit.

I get why people hate Ortiz. He was a big time hitter with a big time personality that rubs some people the wrong way. They try to diminish his accomplishments with nonsense bc they are haters. I get it. Steroids don’t just work in late innings or WS. Ortiz was at his best when the moment was big. Bonds can’t say that.
 
dbldwn711 said:
I know baseball was testing for it much much more after 2004. You think he eluded all those tests for a decade?

have you seen the video of Ortiz hitting moon shots when he was a nobody in the Dominican league? Arod and Griffey jr challenged anyone to a HR hitting contest and an unknown Ortiz crushed them both but according to you he WASNT juicing then.

When Ortiz got released from the twins organization several baseball people went crazy telling the organization they just cut their best hitter. Even in Boston Ortiz was buried on the depth chart till he got his chance. When he did he never looked back. To be a hitter you’ve gotta get significant ABs. Ortiz finally got them in Boston.

Ortiz has 3 WS rings. He was a major part of all three of them. He may have been the biggest part. Bonds has ZERO championships. He was barely called upon to perform in the clutch bc he was almost never in the clutch. Nobody thinks of him as a “leader” because he isn’t one. He’s a “me” guy. Bonds was always stand-offish with the press. That’s why Ortiz is “loved” and bonds isn’t. @Illustrious Potentate trying to call it a “double standard” bc of steroid use is horseshit.

I get why people hate Ortiz. He was a big time hitter with a big time personality that rubs some people the wrong way. They try to diminish his accomplishments with nonsense bc they are haters. I get it. Steroids don’t just work in late innings or WS. Ortiz was at his best when the moment was big. Bonds can’t say that.
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Your homerish rants and diatribes not withstanding, there are no credible sources who would argue that Ortiz was a better player than Bonds. He just wasn’t. Hell, he didn’t even play half of the game. There is no credible argument that would say he didn’t cheat for at least part of his career. He failed the exact same number of tests as Bonds and it is well known that players got much better at finding substances and processes that helped them elude testing. Whether Ortiz quit or just got better at it is unknown.

You are correct that Bonds didn’t win any rings. He didn’t get many chances to. No hitter in history was avoided as much as Bonds was. He didn’t “perform in the clutch” because the Giants didn‘t put players around him that would concern opponents enough to actually pitch to him. Hell, the guy was walked intentionally with the bases loaded.

I don’t hate Ortiz. I don’t even dislike him. But to say that he is meritorious of the HOF and Bonds isn’t is laughable.
 
Bonds wasn’t “clutch” because he wasn’t allowed to be. Hard to come up with a big hit when he was intentionally walked everytime he came up in big moments. He was a beast in the lone World Series his team made it to, but the rest of his team wasn’t up to snuff and let the Angels comeback to win it

When you’re intentionally walked with the bases loaded in the 9th inning of a two run game and it was considered a smart move, that’s dominance
 
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dbldwn711 said:
I know baseball was testing for it much much more after 2004. You think he eluded all those tests for a decade?

have you seen the video of Ortiz hitting moon shots when he was a nobody in the Dominican league? Arod and Griffey jr challenged anyone to a HR hitting contest and an unknown Ortiz crushed them both but according to you he WASNT juicing then.

When Ortiz got released from the twins organization several baseball people went crazy telling the organization they just cut their best hitter. Even in Boston Ortiz was buried on the depth chart till he got his chance. When he did he never looked back. To be a hitter you’ve gotta get significant ABs. Ortiz finally got them in Boston.

Ortiz has 3 WS rings. He was a major part of all three of them. He may have been the biggest part. Bonds has ZERO championships. He was barely called upon to perform in the clutch bc he was almost never in the clutch. Nobody thinks of him as a “leader” because he isn’t one. He’s a “me” guy. Bonds was always stand-offish with the press. That’s why Ortiz is “loved” and bonds isn’t. @Illustrious Potentate trying to call it a “double standard” bc of steroid use is horseshit.

I get why people hate Ortiz. He was a big time hitter with a big time personality that rubs some people the wrong way. They try to diminish his accomplishments with nonsense bc they are haters. I get it. Steroids don’t just work in late innings or WS. Ortiz was at his best when the moment was big. Bonds can’t say that.
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Maaaaan, you are so full of shit. :laugh:
 
And one player isn’t gonna win a World Series or even make a team good. Look at Mike Trout.

Ted Williams never won a WS either, was he not “clutch”?
 
williewilliejuan said:
Your homerish rants and diatribes not withstanding, there are no credible sources who would argue that Ortiz was a better player than Bonds. He just wasn’t. Hell, he didn’t even play half of the game. There is no credible argument that would say he didn’t cheat for at least part of his career. He failed the exact same number of tests as Bonds and it is well known that players got much better at finding substances and processes that helped them elude testing. Whether Ortiz quit or just got better at it is unknown.

You are correct that Bonds didn’t win any rings. He didn’t get many chances to. No hitter in history was avoided as much as Bonds was. He didn’t “perform in the clutch” because the Giants didn‘t put players around him that would concern opponents enough to actually pitch to him. Hell, the guy was walked intentionally with the bases loaded.

I don’t hate Ortiz. I don’t even dislike him. But to say that he is meritorious of the HOF and Bonds isn’t is laughable.
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wow! Way to reframe SEVERAL arguments to make yourself feel better.

let’s start at the beginning:

Show me where I said Ortiz is a better player than bonds

Show me where I said Ortiz didn’t cheat for part of his career

Show me where I said Bonds isn’t a HOF player.

I’ll wait for ALL those…

in the meantime, let’s talk about the play on the field. Both you and @Illustrious Potentate make the point that Ortiz didn’t play the field. That he was only “half” a player yet bonds was a complete player who played the field AND hit. Yet, it’s undeniable that Ortiz had much more of an IMPACT on his team winning championships. How is that possible? How is it possible that a “half player” can literally put a team in his back and carry them to championships time and time again? I’ll tell you… because he was a leader. Because he was clutch… and not just in the post season but GETTING to the post season. Add in that bonds didn’t play in nearly as tough a division as Ortiz did and that feat becomes even more impressive. The fact is Ortiz accomplished more than Bonds despite only being “half a player” AND playing against tougher competition. That’s not “homerism”… that’s fact.
 
dbldwn711 said:
wow! Way to reframe SEVERAL arguments to make yourself feel better.

let’s start at the beginning:

Show me where I said Ortiz is a better player than bonds

Show me where I said Ortiz didn’t cheat for part of his career

Show me where I said Bonds isn’t a HOF player.

I’ll wait for ALL those…

in the meantime, let’s talk about the play on the field. Both you and @Illustrious Potentate make the point that Ortiz didn’t play the field. That he was only “half” a player yet bonds was a complete player who played the field AND hit. Yet, it’s undeniable that Ortiz had much more of an IMPACT on his team winning championships. How is that possible? How is it possible that a “half player” can literally put a team in his back and carry them to championships time and time again? I’ll tell you… because he was a leader. Because he was clutch… and not just in the post season but GETTING to the post season. Add in that bonds didn’t play in nearly as tough a division as Ortiz did and that feat becomes even more impressive. The fact is Ortiz accomplished more than Bonds despite only being “half a player” AND playing against tougher competition. That’s not “homerism”… that’s fact.
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That’s a “fact” that no one other than a Red Sox homer would agree with.
 
Illustrious Potentate said:
And one player isn’t gonna win a World Series or even make a team good. Look at Mike Trout.

Ted Williams never won a WS either, was he not “clutch”?
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it’s not just the play on the field. It’s leadership. I keep pointing it out and the silence back is deafening. Bonds was Stand-offish with the media and his own teammates. He’s the epitome of a “me@ guy but go ahead and ignore ALL that.
 
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