Reunion Baseball Draft : CHAT

[UK Cowboy]

You're really reaching now. Joe Williams had a losing record and an era in the mid threes, Rogan was good pitcher but a really small sample size, Paige was great but none of these guys threw 300+ innings a season.

I didn't take any of the pitchers, though I think Paige had to be great. I don't think there can't be any question on guys like Gibson and Charleston though

 

[Nosferatu]

Bill Veeck saw the entire career of Sandy Koufax, Don Drysdale and Bob Feller...and said Paige was better than any of them

Bill Veeck was a showman who sent Eddie Gaedel to the plate. Sorry if I don't put much stock in his opinions.

 

[Nosferatu]

I don't think there can't be any question on guys like Gibson and Charleston though

Absolutely agree.

 

[UK Cowboy]

Bill Veeck was a showman who sent Eddie Gaedel to the plate. Sorry if I don't put much stock in his opinions.

Point taken, but I think Paige was definitely great. Bob Gibson was a top 5-10 pitcher depending on how you look at it and Mariano is the greatest RP. This is what makes baseball the greatest sport to me. Not a debate you can really have about NBA or NFL players. Today's players are simply better

 

[Nosferatu]

Point taken, but I think Paige was definitely great. Bob Gibson was a top 5-10 pitcher depending on how you look at it and Mariano is the greatest RP. This is what makes baseball the greatest sport to me. Not a debate you can really have about NBA or NFL players. Today's players are simply better

I agree on the NFL and NBA but I still think the changes in money paid, nutrition, supplements and everything else modern players have that older players didn't makes a difference.

Gibson is without question one of the greatest starting pitchers of all time but what other black starter would you put in the top 30?

Mariano is Latin not black, but he just might be the greatest pitcher of all time starter or reliever.

 

[Shanemansj13]

These are the quotes that have me thinking most of these guys are reminiscing and exaggerating, sure the greatest could be greats in MLB but cmon, there is a reason only 9 players have hit more than 600 HR's (6 in the last 30 years). 162 games is grueling.

"In Havana's Tropical Park, the center-field fence is 60 feet high and more than 500 feet from the plate. Teammate Willie Wells recalled a gargantuan drive that carried over the heads of the soldiers on horseback riding crowd control duty behind the fence, a total of about 600 feet. Afterward, a marker was placed at the spot, commemorating the prodigious homer."

-- James A. Riley talking about Mule Suttles

 

[citysushi]

My point is I agree on hitters, there would be some that would no question be in the top 20 or 30 of all time but not for pitchers. Blacks have been in the bigs for 70+ years and Fergie Jenkins is in 29th place all time with 284 wins, most by a black pitcher.



Look at active leaders in wins.



View attachment 58682


Even in todays game there just isnt many black pitchers. David Price is the only one in the top 40-50 I believe in wins.

Because of these reasons I just don't think players in the negro leagues would have put up the same kinda stats if they would have played in the majors. But again there is no question someone like Oscar Charleston would have been incredible no matter what league he played in.

IMO, you just don't see a lot of African American baseball players because of a few components:

1) Baseball is pretty expensive overall to play.
2) You can't organize baseball games on the fly like you can a pick up game of basketball or football.
3) Baseball in general is losing interest these days.
4) You can work on individual drills for both basketball and football but you need many more people to organize instructional baseball drills.

I don't think it's a talent aspect, it's more or an interest aspect. So it's hard to quantify these results because they don't represent the active field of athletes.

 

[UK Cowboy]

I agree on the NFL and NBA but I still think the changes in money paid, nutrition, supplements and everything else modern players have that older players didn't makes a difference.

Gibson is without question one of the greatest starting pitchers of all time but what other black starter would you put in the top 30?

Mariano is Latin not black, but he just might be the greatest pitcher of all time starter or reliever.

Chapman is one of the best RP's too. Granted there are many more white than black pitchers, but I think that's because baseball is a skill sport more than an athletic sport, and most of the better black athletes play basketball or football.
That's what I love about baseball. There's no way Jose Altuve or Dustin Pedroia could make a team, let alone be Most Valuable Player in the NBA or NFL

 

[Nosferatu]

IMO, you just don't see a lot of African American baseball players because of a few components:

1) Baseball is pretty expensive overall to play.
2) You can't organize baseball games on the fly like you can a pick up game of basketball or football.
3) Baseball in general is losing interest these days.
4) You can work on individual drills for both basketball and football but you need many more people to organize instructional baseball drills.

I don't think it's a talent aspect, it's more or an interest aspect. So it's hard to quantify these results because they don't represent the active field of athletes.

1. Baseball does not cost a lot to play.
2. Sure you can, if you have room for football you have room for baseball.
3. Agreed
4. Not true at all

I don't agree with your final line, I never said it was about talent and as far as interest that may be true in today's America it certainly wasn't 100 years ago or even 50.

 

[UK Cowboy]

IMO, you just don't see a lot of African American baseball players because of a few components:

1) Baseball is pretty expensive overall to play.
2) You can't organize baseball games on the fly like you can a pick up game of basketball or football.
3) Baseball in general is losing interest these days.
4) You can work on individual drills for both basketball and football but you need many more people to organize instructional baseball drills.

I don't think it's a talent aspect, it's more or an interest aspect. So it's hard to quantify these results because they don't represent the active field of athletes.

I agree. Coaching for the last 20 years, you might see 1 black player for every 10 that gets hitting or pitching lessons. It matters in a skill sport

 

[UK Cowboy]

1. Baseball does not cost a lot to play.
2. Sure you can, if you have room for football you have room for baseball.
3. Agreed
4. Not true at all

I don't agree with your final line, I never said it was about talent and as far as interest that may be true in today's America it certainly wasn't 100 years ago or even 50.

I know where I live in East Texas where football is king, most kids play spring football now and 7-7 in summer over baseball. We produce a lot of great baseball players but not like football

 

[citysushi]

1. Baseball does not cost a lot to play.
2. Sure you can, if you have room for football you have room for baseball.
3. Agreed
4. Not true at all

I don't agree with your final line, I never said it was about talent and as far as interest that may be true in today's America it certainly wasn't 100 years ago or even 50.

1) Here are two articles on costs associated with playing the various sports:

Paying to Play: How much do club sports cost?

We rounded up coaches among our staff at NCSA to help you understand the costs associated with some club and travel sports.

usatodayhss.com

Kids aren't playing enough sports. The culprit? Cost

Youth sports participation is down nationwide. We're taking a look at the issues -- cost, time and travel -- and what's being done to fix this problem.

www.espn.com

The average cost to play baseball overall might be not as much as say basketball or football but on the competitive side there are major differences. I'm not familiar with baseball as much but AAU teams are heavily sponsored these days and most don't have to pay a ton to play in these major tournaments or camps.

2) Today, you think it's easier for kids to go find a few guys to play a game of 2 on 2 or 3 on 3 or to find 10 guys(minimum) with baseball equipment to go out and organize a game?

4) A kid can work on his ball handling with just a basketball and some pavement by themselves. They can work on a jumpshot by themselves by just finding a hooping and playing. How can a kid teach himself how to throw a proper curveball or slider? If a kid doesn't have a tee, how does he work on his hitting?

I think it is about talent because athletic talent at the highest levels are not being funneled towards baseball. They're being funneled a lot to basketball and football.

 

[Nosferatu]

1) Here are two articles on costs associated with playing the various sports:

Paying to Play: How much do club sports cost?

We rounded up coaches among our staff at NCSA to help you understand the costs associated with some club and travel sports.

usatodayhss.com

Kids aren't playing enough sports. The culprit? Cost

Youth sports participation is down nationwide. We're taking a look at the issues -- cost, time and travel -- and what's being done to fix this problem.

www.espn.com

The average cost to play baseball overall might be not as much as say basketball or football but on the competitive side there are major differences. I'm not familiar with baseball as much but AAU teams are heavily sponsored these days and most don't have to pay a ton to play in these major tournaments or camps.

2) Today, you think it's easier for kids to go find a few guys to play a game of 2 on 2 or 3 on 3 or to find 10 guys(minimum) with baseball equipment to go out and organize a game?

4) A kid can work on his ball handling with just a basketball and some pavement by themselves. They can work on a jumpshot by themselves by just finding a hooping and playing. How can a kid teach himself how to throw a proper curveball or slider? If a kid doesn't have a tee, how does he work on his hitting?

I think it is about talent because athletic talent at the highest levels are not being funneled towards baseball. They're being funneled a lot to basketball and football.

All you need is a hitter a pitcher and a couple fielders, baseball equipment? You mean a glove a bat and a ball?

What exactly do you think playing 3 on 3 in basketball or football does for you that 3 on 3 can't in baseball?

I agree baseball is a dying sport. People are steered towards basketball and football because you can succeed on athletic ability alone, doesn't really take much talent to throw a ball into a hole, certainly not like it does to hit a round ball with a round bat that someones throwing at you.


Also, I played all five team sports when I was a kid, football and hockey were by far the most expensive sports to play.

 

[citysushi]

All you need is a hitter a pitcher and a couple fielders, baseball equipment? You mean a glove a bat and a ball?

What exactly do you think playing 3 on 3 in basketball or football does for you that 3 on 3 can't in baseball?

I agree baseball is a dying sport. People are steered towards basketball and football because you can succeed on athletic ability alone, doesn't really take much talent to throw a ball into a hole, certainly not like it does to hit a round ball with a round bat that someones throwing at you.


Also, I played all five team sports when I was a kid, football and hockey were by far the most expensive sports to play.

Yeah a bat and glove. You play with 6 guys all of them need to have at least a glove. For basketball or football all you need is one ball. It's easier to find people willing to play when there's less logistics.

All my friends and I played little league together and we also played basketball. If given the chance back then to go out and play something, given a football, a basketball and all of us had our baseball gear, baseball would 100% be the last choice.

 

[Nosferatu]

Yeah a bat and glove. You play with 6 guys all of them need to have at least a glove. For basketball or football all you need is one ball. It's easier to find people willing to play when there's less logistics.

All my friends and I played little league together and we also played basketball. If given the chance back then to go out and play something, given a football, a basketball and all of us had our baseball gear, baseball would 100% be the last choice.

If you have a tennis ball then you don't need gloves. Everyone did have a glove we weren't growing up in a third world country.

You just said you and all of your friends played little league, if that's true then you all had gloves, lolzzz

In my childhood if someone suggested basketball we would have laughed at them and pushed them down!

 

[citysushi]

If you have a tennis ball then you don't need gloves, lolzzzz Everyone did have a glove we weren't growing up in a third world country.

In my childhood if someone suggested basketball we would have laughed at them and pushed them down!

 

[Nosferatu]

 

[citysushi]

 

[Nosferatu]

 

[Nosferatu]

Where da heck is Stoke?