Shoeless Joe Jackson

SlinkyRedfoot said:
Because he was illiterate.

Non-reading son of a bitch!
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Hitman Hart said:
what makes you so sure that Rose is getting in after he dies? Sport commissioners seem to fear overturning precedents set by their predecessor. Super weird.
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Rose got a lifetime ban. Not a forever ban.
 
Illustrious Potentate said:
Hopefully Manfred dies before Pete, but I don’t think they’ll keep out the hit king forever. When he dies, his sentence will be served
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Manfred dying before Rose has nothing to do with anything (unless you just wish I’ll of Manfred, in which case, please carry on). The ban was handed down by Giamatti and supported by Vincent, Selig and now Manfred.
 
Mofo said:
Meanwhile, MLB and HOF will continue to celebrate 'juiced ball' era meatheads and continue to forgive PED users.
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wha…huh???

the Hall and MLB are wiping Bonds-juice from their chin? They have a Clemens sore throat?
 
calsnowskier said:
Manfred dying before Rose has nothing to do with anything (unless you just wish I’ll of Manfred, in which case, please carry on). The ban was handed down by Giamatti and supported by Vincent, Selig and now Manfred.
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Nah, I just hate Manfred.
 
Guy Incognito said:
He'd have better totals if he hadn't gotten booted from the league for throwing the World Series.
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Can’t give credit to someone for something that didn’t happen.
 
calsnowskier said:
wha…huh???

the Hall and MLB are wiping Bonds-juice from their chin? They have a Clemens sore throat?
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Every year the BBWAA gets younger and friendlier towards the roid-heads. I doubt A-Rod ever gets in, but Bonds, Sosa, McGwire... it's just a matter of time.
 
Better question. Will we ever be able to think about Shoeless Joe without seeing Ray Liotta's creepy raper face?
 
White Knight said:
Ty Cobb called him the best hitter in baseball. I'm sure he knew more than you'll ever know about the game.
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I'm not saying that Joe wasn't a great hitter, he was. But great players are wrong about (and exaggerate) this kind of stuff all the time.


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Hal Chase of course was infamously crooked. But he wasn't the superstar that Ruth believed he was (the Babe picked him over the likes of Gehrig and Sisler on his "All-Time" team) even when he was playing straight up.

"the best baserunner I ever saw"

Sure he was Babe. No one except Cobb :rolleyes:


source for graphic: Dark Past: The Evil Prince of Baseball Hal Chase
 
navamind said:
the only hitter I'd say was better during Jackson's career was Cobb and maybe Speaker, unless you count Ruth and Hornsby. But Ruth only had two full seasons as a position player during Jackson's career and Hornsby's best years came after 1920.

Yeah Shoeless had a very brief career, but he still managed over 60 WAR despite having only 5694 PA. He finished in the top 10 in WAR eight times and had nine seasons in the top 10 in OPS+ (all top 5 finishes). I think his career is HOF worthy, especially if short career guys like Kiner are in.

of course, there's the whole Black Sox thing...
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Speaking of the 1919 Sox... he is still probably a rung below Jackson as a hitter but people really underestimate how good a player Eddie Collins was during that era.
 
DragonFromTo said:
Speaking of the 1919 Sox... he is still probably a rung below Jackson as a hitter but people really underestimate how good a player Eddie Collins was during that era.
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amazing offensive 2B, the only 2B with a higher OPS+ were Hornsby and Lajoie.
 
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