Players Now Demand A Chunk Of Media Rights Revenue.

[WhosYourDawggy]

Who do you think is doubling revenue? You're pie in the sky ideas are non starters without addressing reality.

The B1G and the SEC. So now address the rest. Do you disagree the players have to become an expense?

 

[NU_WTF?]

The B1G and the SEC. So now address the rest. Do you disagree the players have to become an expense?

Show me the numbers that make you think they are doubling revenue

 

[Goldbug]

Now we are getting somewhere. I've stated a few times I am just shooting from the hip ... that's how one forms ideas. I'm open to listening to what you have to say and learning from it if you make sense. You should try this.

There is going to be a discussion about paying players at some point. Hell, it's here. SCOTUS in Alston guaranteed that.

I see where you are coming from with the "profit" v. "revenue." I'll think through that. What I was thinking is that you have at least two conferences that are about to double their revenue. Even the B12 is going to get more than they were before. Before they start spending all that increased revenue, perhaps they should consider spending it on an expense they need ... the athletes or the labor. If they don't, SCOTUS is going to make them. So throwing up their hands and saying we are broke all the while signing multi-billion dollar deals isn't going to work.

As for your profit v. revenue, we agree that profit = revenue - expenses, I assume. Can you agree that the labor that produces the revenue needs to be an expense? I mean if the schools aren't having to even pay their labor and still can't make a profit, seems like they aren't running a good business. I have to look at what I pay my employees when we set our budgets every year. I'd argue that once they get it into their heads that they are going to have to finally pay for the labor, then they have to figure out what other expenses to cut. Maybe coaches salaries (although they are often paid out of other funds), or administrators, or facilities (again often paid out of other funds). But, as SCOTUS said in Alston, fixing the price of labor at zero isn't going to work.

Here is a good breakdown on expenses for a major school ... this site is great:

Sportico’s Intercollegiate Finance Database

Sportico is maintaining an interactive, real-time database that tracks the official balance sheets of public FBS university athletic departments.

www.sportico.com

That's Florida. Let's look into this to see where that money could come from to pay the labor. I looked at Buffalo and App State, totally different scenarios. How do you do this so it works for both levels of teams?

If the only reason people are staying at a company is because of the high pay that company is destined for trouble. We pay excellent wages but not always the top salaries because our work atmosphere is better than anywhere else they can find. Time off, training, respect for our workers and their families, long term job security, fringe benefits, our financial strength that has never forced us to have layoffs during lean times, etc. all added up trump the higher paycheck someone might get at a competitor. We even paid everyone a full paycheck during COVID when many of our people had to stay home. Labor is an important expense; but it's not THE expense that makes or breaks a healthy company.

 

[WhosYourDawggy]

If the only reason people are staying at a company is because of the high pay that company is destined for trouble. We pay excellent wages but not always the top salaries because our work atmosphere is better than anywhere else they can find. Time off, training, respect for our workers and their families, long term job security, fringe benefits, our financial strength that has never forced us to have layoffs during lean times, etc. all added up trump the higher paycheck someone might get at a competitor. We even paid everyone a full paycheck during COVID when many of our people had to stay home. Labor is an important expense; but it's not THE expense that makes or breaks a healthy company.

I can't disagree with anything you typed, but that's not the discussion. The discussion is should college football get to set the price on their labor (the players) to just scholarship and other benefits. I am not going to say "set the price on their labor at zero" as I believe there is a lot of value in scholarships, room and board, training, etc. But, that's not really an expense ... it's a ledger entry.

Look, I am a traditionalist and wish CFB was like it was in the past. But I am a realist and it is going to change. I've criticized those who have cited Kavanaugh's concurrence as if it were the majority opinion. It's not. But he does lay out the problem that the NCAA faces ... you can't avoid anti-trust law by defining your market by stating it's a market where we don't pay our labor, and therefore it's not subject to the anti-trust laws. While not explicitly stated in the majority opinion, it is clearly implied that is so. Kavanaugh clearly stated it in his concurrence.

Businesses like the NCAA cannot avoid the consequences of price-fixing labor by incorporating price-fixed labor into the definition of the product. Or to put it in more doctrinal terms, a monopsony cannot launder its price-fixing of labor by calling it product definition.

Even he realizes this won't be easy:

If it turns out that some or all of the NCAA’s remaining compensation rules violate the antitrust laws, some difficult policy and practical questions would undoubtedly ensue. Among them: How would paying greater compensation to student athletes affect non-revenue-raising sports? Could student athletes in some sports but not others receive compensation? How would any compensation regime comply with Title IX? If paying student athletes requires something like a salary cap in some sports in order to preserve competitive balance, how would that cap be administered? And given that there are now about 180,000 Division I student athletes, what is a financially sustainable way of fairly compensating some or all of those student athletes?

He goes on to say how they might be resolved:

Of course, those difficult questions could be resolved in ways other than litigation. Legislation would be one option. Or colleges and student athletes could potentially engage in collective bargaining (or seek some other negotiated agreement) to provide student athletes a fairer share of the revenues that they generate for their colleges, akin to how professional football and basketball players have negotiated for a share of league revenues. Regardless of how those issues ultimately would be resolved, however, the NCAA’s current compensation regime raises serious questions under the antitrust laws.

To be sure, the NCAA and its member colleges maintain important traditions that have become part of the fabric of America—game days in Tuscaloosa and South Bend; the packed gyms in Storrs and Durham; the women’s and men’s lacrosse championships on Memorial Day weekend; track and field meets in Eugene; the spring softball and baseball World Series in Oklahoma City and Omaha; the list goes on. But those traditions alone cannot justify the NCAA’s decision to build a massive money-raising enterprise on the backs of student athletes who are not fairly compensated. Nowhere else in America can businesses get away with agreeing not to pay their workers a fair market rate on the theory that their product is defined by not paying their workers a fair market rate. And under ordinary principles of antitrust law, it is not evident why college sports should be any different. The NCAA is not above the law.

The simple fact is that when you make billions of dollars, and you aren't coming close to paying fair market value for your labor, you are going to lose. They are trying NIL in order to have the payments come from 3rd parties. But that won't meet the Alston standard. Eventually, the players will be back in front of SCOTUS arguing the points that Kavanaugh makes. The NCAA can do that and lose, or they can work with Congress (LOL), or they can figure out a way to get some of the money to the athletes. The medical aspect of this seems a no brainer to me.

 

[WhosYourDawggy]

Show me the numbers that make you think they are doubling revenue

The B1G is currently renegotiating its primary media contract. The SEC just did theirs, and it will likely be renegotiated once OU and TX enter the SEC in 2025. The B12 and PAC are both getting new contracts, which is probably a good thing for the B12, not so much for the PAC (should it survive). The ACC, of course, is stuck with its terrible contract through 2036.

That means 4 of the 5 contracts are being renegotiated. As importantly, the CFP will expand in 2026, likely to 12 teams which will come close to quadrupling the media money for the CFP.

The two articles that lay it out for you are cited below. The two key graphs follow. The numbers are off as this was done before the USC/UCLA move. That will increase the take for the B1G, likely decrease if not destroy the PAC, and the B12 may well increase if they raid the PAC.

There is another source I can't find that has the B1G at $110 million, the SEC at $115 million. That also was before USC/UCLA.

How Much Money Can An Expanded College Football Playoff Generate?

AthleticDirectorU and Navigate present financial projections for an expanded 12-team College Football Playoff (CFP).

athleticdirectoru.com

Data firm projects SEC schools topping $100 million in annual revenue by end of decade

And the Big Ten won't be far behind.

footballscoop.com

 

[NU_WTF?]

The B1G is currently renegotiating its primary media contract. The SEC just did theirs, and it will likely be renegotiated once OU and TX enter the SEC in 2025. The B12 and PAC are both getting new contracts, which is probably a good thing for the B12, not so much for the PAC (should it survive). The ACC, of course, is stuck with its terrible contract through 2036.

That means 4 of the 5 contracts are being renegotiated. As importantly, the CFP will expand in 2026, likely to 12 teams which will come close to quadrupling the media money for the CFP.

The two articles that lay it out for you are cited below. The two key graphs follow. The numbers are off as this was done before the USC/UCLA move. That will increase the take for the B1G, likely decrease if not destroy the PAC, and the B12 may well increase if they raid the PAC.

There is another source I can't find that has the B1G at $110 million, the SEC at $115 million. That also was before USC/UCLA.

How Much Money Can An Expanded College Football Playoff Generate?

AthleticDirectorU and Navigate present financial projections for an expanded 12-team College Football Playoff (CFP).

athleticdirectoru.com

Data firm projects SEC schools topping $100 million in annual revenue by end of decade

And the Big Ten won't be far behind.

footballscoop.com

Long way to go to tell me you're wrong about revenue doubling

 

[WhosYourDawggy]

Long way to go to tell me you're wrong about revenue doubling

I just showed you that the revenue doubles for the SEC and B1G. What in the world are you talking about?

 

[NU_WTF?]

I just showed you that the revenue doubles for the SEC and B1G. What in the world are you talking about?

No you showed me a retarded graphic not based in reality but rather some internet kids basement.

Speculation and "projection" doesn't equal reality

 

[WhosYourDawggy]

No you showed me a retarded graphic not based in reality but rather some internet kids basement.

Speculation and "projection" doesn't equal reality

What are you talking about ... there are dozens of articles about what the SEC and the B1G are going to be making. Do you think I am lying? Making this up? Do you even follow college football? This isn't something crazy. You have to know that they are going to be making a ton more.

So, back to the basic question, how would have the players paid if you find my idea so stupid?

 

[NU_WTF?]

What are you talking about ... there are dozens of articles about what the SEC and the B1G are going to be making. Do you think I am lying? Making this up? Do you even follow college football? This isn't something crazy. You have to know that they are going to be making a ton more.

So, back to the basic question, how would have the players paid if you find my idea so stupid?

Lol you're foolish.

First those are wild speculation without any basis in reality. B) media revenue is not total revenue, even if you double media revenue it won't double revenue of each school. Lastly, revenue isn't profits and there's no projected cost for operations per team breakdowns either. 4) you're wrong.

Nearly 900 athletes at Nebraska (who burned over 21m over revenue in 20-21), lots of schools take tax dollars to keep their athletic department floating and competitive. There's no way a judge can forcefully tax a state to pay some whining lil fucks

 

[WhosYourDawggy]

Lol you're foolish.

First those are wild speculation without any basis in reality. B) media revenue is not total revenue, even if you double media revenue it won't double revenue of each school. Lastly, revenue isn't profits and there's no projected cost for operations per team breakdowns either. 4) you're wrong

It's not wild speculation ... these are numbers that are being discussed by the top writers and thinkers in the sport. Why do you not think they aren't going to get this type of money? Seriously, if you want to discuss it seriously, quite be obstinate and think it through.

I agree that media revenue isn't total revenue, but it is the largest part of it. These guys are going to be giving each school an extra $50 million a year.

I understand revenue isn't profit, I've laid that out above. My point is that when these schools get this injection of revenue, they better come up with a way that some of it finds its way to the players. That's where all this started. If the two major conferences' teams get $50 million more per year, and they don't somehow figure out how to start paying the players, the litigation will hit the fan.

I cited you to expense projections ... Sportico’s Intercollegiate Finance Database - pick your school. Adding $50 million to any SEC or B1G team leaves plenty of room to share with the players. I think it needs to be a broader project, but the money is there now.

We know that if you start getting $50 million more per year, that's the time to add an expense item like paying the labor. If there ever was a time the sport could afford it, it would be now.

 

[NU_WTF?]

It's not wild speculation ... these are numbers that are being discussed by the top writers and thinkers in the sport. Why do you not think they aren't going to get this type of money? Seriously, if you want to discuss it seriously, quite be obstinate and think it through.

I agree that media revenue isn't total revenue, but it is the largest part of it. These guys are going to be giving each school an extra $50 million a year.

I understand revenue isn't profit, I've laid that out above. My point is that when these schools get this injection of revenue, they better come up with a way that some of it finds its way to the players. That's where all this started. If the two major conferences' teams get $50 million more per year, and they don't somehow figure out how to start paying the players, the litigation will hit the fan.

I cited you to expense projections ... Sportico’s Intercollegiate Finance Database - pick your school. Adding $50 million to any SEC or B1G team leaves plenty of room to share with the players. I think it needs to be a broader project, but the money is there now.

We know that if you start getting $50 million more per year, that's the time to add an expense item like paying the labor. If there ever was a time the sport could afford it, it would be now.

Lol you clearly don't have a clue. Writers don't pay the bills.

Everything you said is based on wild speculation by people who don't make decisions or pay the bills. These kids are already compensated well .

The whole wall of text is just wrong

 

[WhosYourDawggy]

Lol you clearly don't have a clue. Writers don't pay the bills.

Everything you said is based on wild speculation by people who don't make decisions or pay the bills. These kids are already compensated well .

The whole wall of text is just wrong

Well, I tried child. Back to the kiddies table you go. Why I wasted my time on a third grader, I have no idea. SMMFH.

 

[NU_WTF?]

Well, I tried child. Back to the kiddies table you go. Why I wasted my time on a third grader, I have no idea. SMMFH.

You tried what? You're clueless. "Derr an article speculates it so it must be true even if it can't possibly happen for years derrrrrrr".


You're wrong and you haven't based anything on fact. Show me a signed contract for double revenue.

 

[WhosYourDawggy]

You tried what? You're clueless. "Derr an article speculates it so it must be true even if it can't possibly happen for years derrrrrrr".


You're wrong and you haven't based anything on fact. Show me a signed contract for double revenue.

Back to the kiddies table, adults talking football here. You don't qualify. Double digit IQs not good enough. Double disqualification. Move along child.

 

[NU_WTF?]

Back to the kiddies table, adults talking football here. You don't qualify. Double digit IQs not good enough. Double disqualification. Move along child.

You clearly have no clue. That's why everyone makes fun of you, it's like you just started watching football lol. Especially amusing trying to send people to the "kiddie table" given that's where you've been stuck since joining these forums. Nobody takes you seriously because you're a joke. Keep on self owning your retarded ass

 

[WhosYourDawggy]

You clearly have no clue. That's why everyone makes fun of you, it's like you just started watching football lol. Especially amusing trying to send people to the "kiddie table" given that's where you've been stuck since joining these forums. Nobody takes you seriously because you're a joke. Keep on self owning your retarded ass

Go away child ... adults here. Grow up and you can participate.

 

[NU_WTF?]

Go away child ... adults here. Grow up and you can participate.

Keep licking those windows, Short Bus.

 

[WhosYourDawggy]

Keep licking those windows, Short Bus.

You still around, child? Move along and quit stalking me. I told you I don't engage with people who aren't serious, act like third graders and have double digit IQs. You hit the trifecta. Grow up and you can engage with the adults, child.

 

[NU_WTF?]

You still around, child? Move along and quit stalking me. I told you I don't engage with people who aren't serious, act like third graders and have double digit IQs. You hit the trifecta. Grow up and you can engage with the adults, child.

Nobody is stalking you. You need to just stick to your strawberry flavored windows on your short bus. Window licking retard.