OREGON arriving in the B1G will create changes

Deep Creek said:
You ain’t objective in the least. You cherry pick certain data that supports your preconceived belief to begin with. Sounds like a bunch of politicians. Skinner’s Constant and Flanigan’s Finagleing Factor.
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So you can't support your argument. Got it.

LOL @ using overall winning % as "cherry picking"
 
Deep Creek said:
What the hell am I doing defending the PAC? They won’t even have a conference after next year?
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I'm moreso wondering why you're trying to shit on Cincy and prop up Florida, considering neither has anything to do with the discussion at hand.
 
Across The Field said:
Helton was a mixed bag I felt. Had some good/great years. Only one losing season but 2019 could've/should've been better, 2020 had promise if not for Covid. Obviously it wasn't great, but I'm not sure I'd say there was "a lot" to fix. If anything, Riley needs to end his idiotic relationship with Alex Grinch and maybe USC can take the next step.
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I was a big Helton supporter and used to defend him when folks would criticize him. I believed he would get it figured out turn things around. But he never did. I hate criticizing the guy because he's a genuinely good person. Outside of his coaching, you won't find a single person at USC who has a negative thing to say about him.

Helton was kept for at least 2 years too long, imo. His first couple of seasons were nice because we needed an adult in charge after the frat boys Kiffin and Sark. Helton provided that.

His main problem was his HC experience was as a G5 HC and that's how he tried to run the program. End result was that recruiting dropped off and where we were pretty much always top 10 and usually top 5, we were classes in the 10's and 20's. Not terrible, but you can't compete for NC's like that.

So, we'd end up with winning records every season, but when we got into games vs. the programs that we have traditionally stood toe to toe with like Bama, tOSU, ND, etc. the talent and coaching gap was glaring and was getting worse, not better.

Also, when I say "a lot to fix", I mean in getting back to traditional USC standards. It's why Riley had to hit the portal so hard.

As for Grinch, I'm not holding last year against him. They could only fix one side of the ball at a time and they chose offense. From what I've read and heard, there's more talent on this years defense, so we'll see if they improve.
 
trojanfan12 said:
I was a big Helton supporter and used to defend him when folks would criticize him. I believed he would get it figured out turn things around. But he never did. I hate criticizing the guy because he's a genuinely good person. Outside of his coaching, you won't find a single person at USC who has a negative thing to say about him.

Helton was kept for at least 2 years too long, imo. His first couple of seasons were nice because we needed an adult in charge after the frat boys Kiffin and Sark. Helton provided that.

His main problem was his HC experience was as a G5 HC and that's how he tried to run the program. End result was that recruiting dropped off and where we were pretty much always top 10 and usually top 5, we were classes in the 10's and 20's. Not terrible, but you can't compete for NC's like that.

So, we'd end up with winning records every season, but when we got into games vs. the programs that we have traditionally stood toe to toe with like Bama, tOSU, ND, etc. the talent and coaching gap was glaring and was getting worse, not better.

Also, when I say "a lot to fix", I mean in getting back to traditional USC standards. It's why Riley had to hit the portal so hard.

As for Grinch, I'm not holding last year against him. They could only fix one side of the ball at a time and they chose offense. From what I've read and heard, there's more talent on this years defense, so we'll see if they improve.
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You're right about Helton, he always seemed to be like a good guy. He was handed the keys to a Ferrari when he was 16 basically. The fact that he held on and managed to have some success is a feather in his cap but he's probably at a more appropriate spot now.

Grinch, I'm only saying as an OSU fan who was excited when he came aboard only to see him fail (I think OU fans may also agree). He's another guy who may be a position up above where he should be right now.
 
Deep Creek said:
Oregon didn’t win the PAC the last two years either so I don’t expect them to win the B1G either.

That sounds like Fat Bret while at Arkie. Told the Texas HS coaches at their convention they played “real football” and those other styles couldn’t play with them. A not so great Tech team with Coach GQ goes Into Fayettville a month or so later and wins convincingly. Styles make good fights…boxers and punchers…Ali/Frazier.

Hell, even Jimmy Jam’s team didn’t physically whip a “soft” TCU team last year IIRC. They were supposed to. Georgia did whip their butt because they could play physical AND could match the Froggies in foot speed.
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Some teams aren't built to handle physical teams and they really struggle against them. Oregon is one of them teams, which is why Utah gives them fits. I'm not saying Oregon is going to struggle in the B1G, as there are a bunch of teams in the league they will handle with their talent alone. But they are going to run into a lot more teams who can play that style in the B1G. PSU, Michigan, Wisconsin used to (not sure what they will look like now), Illinois, Michigan State (if Tucker gets them right).

So it should be interesting to see how they fare and how B1G teams fare against them.
 
NewPhoneWhoDis said:
Some teams aren't built to handle physical teams and they really struggle against them. Oregon is one of them teams, which is why Utah gives them fits. I'm not saying Oregon is going to struggle in the B1G, as there are a bunch of teams in the league they will handle with their talent alone. But they are going to run into a lot more teams who can play that style in the B1G. PSU, Michigan, Wisconsin used to (not sure what they will look like now), Illinois, Michigan State (if Tucker gets them right).

So it should be interesting to see how they fare and how B1G teams fare against them.
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Wisconsin's o-line is people by mostly juniors and sophomores. I don't see many leaving early, so you'll probably see the same before up front. Going more spread will make a difference but Longo likes big, beefy linemen si I think another year of experience before the immigrants arrive should help them to be ready.
 
NewPhoneWhoDis said:
Some teams aren't built to handle physical teams and they really struggle against them. Oregon is one of them teams, which is why Utah gives them fits. I'm not saying Oregon is going to struggle in the B1G, as there are a bunch of teams in the league they will handle with their talent alone. But they are going to run into a lot more teams who can play that style in the B1G. PSU, Michigan, Wisconsin used to (not sure what they will look like now), Illinois, Michigan State (if Tucker gets them right).

So it should be interesting to see how they fare and how B1G teams fare against them.
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Didn't hurt them vs Ohio State or Wisconsin
 
fishinabarrel said:
Cant speak for Wisconsin but Ohio State was NOT a physical team in 2021. They couldn't stop the run at all and more much more finesse on offense
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It showed. Oregon outmuscled you guys
 
fishinabarrel said:
But it doesn't help your point to say Oregon can handle physical teams by bringing up 2021 Ohio State.
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If Ohio State was able to win lots of B1G games without being physical that year, it seems weird to say Oregon has to play physical to win in the B1G.
 
michaeljordan_fan said:
If Ohio State was able to win lots of B1G games without being physical that year, it seems weird to say Oregon has to play physical to win in the B1G.
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Ohio State was able to win lots of games that year bc they had Chris olave, Garrett Wilson, and Jaxon Smith as their wide receivers and CJ Stroud throwing them the ball. Even with the crazy talent Hartline continues to bring in, it's going to be hard to ever top having all three of those guys.

If they got rolling early and took a teams ability to run away, it was game over
 
fishinabarrel said:
Ohio State was able to win lots of games that year bc they had Chris olave, Garrett Wilson, and Jaxon Smith as their wide receivers and CJ Stroud throwing them the ball. Even with the crazy talent Hartline continues to bring in, it's going to be hard to ever top having all three of those guys.

If they got rolling early and took a teams ability to run away, it was game over
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So you're saying physical play is not necessary to win in the B1G if you have studs at skill positions?
 
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