2024 Season Thread

[Y.O.M.]

This sport is a Joke. Logano was dogshit all year. Won a lucky fuel mileage race at Nashville to make the chase. Had a lucky win at Atlanta to advance. Is ELIMINATED but gets back in on a penalty..and now a fuel mileage win at Vegas gets him in the CHAMPIONSHIP RACE??!!

Dude has had 5 good races all fkn year and he might win the championship. The sport is broken. It shouldn’t be like this

Let me ask you a question. The 2007 New York football Giants were a mediocre team, at best. They finished the season 10-6, with a couple of those wins being on the "by the skin of their teeth" scale. They got into the playoffs as a Wild Card. The NFC Championship game they only one because the Packers inexplicably choked the game away, and the Giants got really lucky on a wind-influenced FG in OT to miraculously win the game and advance to the Superbowl - to face the undefeated juggernaut Patriots. Again, because apparently fate and luck were on their side, they had an obscene amount of things go their way 9and an equally obscene amount of things NOT go the Patriots way) and they actually managed to beat the undefeated Patriots, win the Superbowl, and go down as champions in a way that would propel Eli to the NFL HOF.

Was the NFL broken? Should it "be like that"? Or is it just as simple as getting hot (or lucky) at the right time, and finding a way to win when it matters most?

I'm just curious if these same thought processes and logic patterns apply only to NASCAR or if people are being consistent. Because in literally every single professional level sport, teams get in who probably shouldn't have, teams win games or events that nobody expected, and teams become Champions in weird ways when nobody saw it coming and the result doesn't mesh with the regular season. But it happens. Everywhere. Every sport. When it happens in Motorsports, though, entirely too many people scream conspiracy or the system is broke or the rules need changed. It's an interesting thing to me.

 

[Illustrious Potentate]

Let me ask you a question. The 2007 New York football Giants were a mediocre team, at best. They finished the season 10-6, with a couple of those wins being on the "by the skin of their teeth" scale. They got into the playoffs as a Wild Card. The NFC Championship game they only one because the Packers inexplicably choked the game away, and the Giants got really lucky on a wind-influenced FG in OT to miraculously win the game and advance to the Superbowl - to face the undefeated juggernaut Patriots. Again, because apparently fate and luck were on their side, they had an obscene amount of things go their way 9and an equally obscene amount of things NOT go the Patriots way) and they actually managed to beat the undefeated Patriots, win the Superbowl, and go down as champions in a way that would propel Eli to the NFL HOF.

Was the NFL broken? Should it "be like that"? Or is it just as simple as getting hot (or lucky) at the right time, and finding a way to win when it matters most?

I'm just curious if these same thought processes and logic patterns apply only to NASCAR or if people are being consistent. Because in literally every single professional level sport, teams get in who probably shouldn't have, teams win games or events that nobody expected, and teams become Champions in weird ways when nobody saw it coming and the result doesn't mesh with the regular season. But it happens. Everywhere. Every sport. When it happens in Motorsports, though, entirely too many people scream conspiracy or the system is broke or the rules need changed. It's an interesting thing to me.

Comparing ball sports to motorsports is a non starter. When you’re the only Motorsport in the world that doesn’t use a full season format, it’s not everyone else that’s wrong

Having a championship format in NASCAR where it’s possible for a driver to win the first 35 races of the season and finish second in the finale and not be the champion is objectively stupid

But FTR, I think too many teams make the playoffs in the NFL and MLB. I don’t care about roundball or hockey, so don’t know their playoff format

 

[Y.O.M.]

Comparing ball sports to motorsports is a non starter. When you’re the only Motorsport in the world that doesn’t use a full season format, it’s not everyone else that’s wrong

Having a championship format in NASCAR where it’s possible for a driver to win the first 35 races of the season and finish second in the finale and not be the champion is objectively stupid

But FTR, I think too many teams make the playoffs in the NFL and MLB. I don’t care about roundball or hockey, so don’t know their playoff format

Disagree.

Forces said named dominant driver and team to still show up and be competitive for that final race. If they're so dominant - shouldn't be a problem right? Because if it doesn't all matter in the last race or two, and the championship is already clinched, isn't that also a broken system? Who the feck cares to watch races where nothing matters? NASCAR has been there - and it was gay.

 

[fordman84]

Comparing ball sports to motorsports is a non starter. When you’re the only Motorsport in the world that doesn’t use a full season format, it’s not everyone else that’s wrong

Having a championship format in NASCAR where it’s possible for a driver to win the first 35 races of the season and finish second in the finale and not be the champion is objectively stupid

But FTR, I think too many teams make the playoffs in the NFL and MLB. I don’t care about roundball or hockey, so don’t know their playoff format

I see it differently. If you are able to accumulate enough points to get to the championship without winning, that tells me that you were a very efficient and effective driver because you were in every single race. Now the person who won all but the last one will have a point that they were more efficient and more effective but my response would be "not when it mattered the most".

We see wildcard teams win in every sport.

 

[Illustrious Potentate]

Disagree.

Forces said named dominant driver and team to still show up and be competitive for that final race. If they're so dominant - shouldn't be a problem right? Because if it doesn't all matter in the last race or two, and the championship is already clinched, isn't that also a broken system? Who the feck cares to watch races where nothing matters? NASCAR has been there - and it was gay.

A more apt ball sport comparison is that 7 game nail biter World Series and overtime thriller Super Bowls special because they happen organically. They’re not special without some years being sweeps and blowouts

1992 still gets talked about because of how great the championship battle was, and in 2019, Busch beats Harvick by a single point under the old format, but we were robbed.

Dominance should be appreciated

You dominate the first 35 races, but then something out of the driver and team’s control happens like a blown tire and you don’t win it all. It’s stupid, gay and manufactured drama

 

[Illustrious Potentate]

I see it differently. If you are able to accumulate enough points to get to the championship without winning, that tells me that you were a very efficient and effective driver because you were in every single race. Now the person who won all but the last one will have a point that they were more efficient and more effective but my response would be "not when it mattered the most".

We see wildcard teams win in every sport.

What if said driver leads every lap of the finale as well, but something out of his and the team’s control like a blown tire happens on the final lap, and has to limp to a second place finish? Driver and team still showed up when it mattered.

There’s a reason why Gordon is mentioned in the same breath as Petty, Pearson and Dale, but Jimmie Johnson isn’t

 

[fordman84]

What if said driver leads every lap of the finale as well, but something out of his and the team’s control like a blown tire happens on the final lap, and has to limp to a second place finish? Driver and team still showed up when it mattered.

There’s a reason why Gordon is mentioned in the same breath as Petty, Pearson and Dale, but Jimmie Johnson isn’t

I'd chalk it up to bad luck like happens in all competitions. As for the old racers vs the new, you will never have another guy like those old school drivers. There is too much parity in NASCAR these days, too many penalties for trivial stuff that can get you an advantage.

What I'm waiting to see happen is a championship race where the champ doesn't even finish the race. Some wreck takes all four (is it still even four?) contenders out and the winner is by default with 100+ laps still remaining

 

[Illustrious Potentate]

I'd chalk it up to bad luck like happens in all competitions. As for the old racers vs the new, you will never have another guy like those old school drivers. There is too much parity in NASCAR these days, too many penalties for trivial stuff that can get you an advantage.

What I'm waiting to see happen is a championship race where the champ doesn't even finish the race. Some wreck takes all four (is it still even four?) contenders out and the winner is by default with 100+ laps still remaining

You know damn well if that happened, NASCAR would stop the race and allow the championship 4 to re-enter the race in their backup cars on the lead lap

And don’t get me wrong, I still like the racing, and I think the current points system makes way more sense than the Winston Cup points, and I even like the idea of stages(just don’t see a reason for a caution, award the points and keep it moving). But the championship needs to be decided in a season long format like every other racing league from your local dirt track to F1 does

 

[Y.O.M.]

What if said driver leads every lap of the finale as well, but something out of his and the team’s control like a blown tire happens on the final lap, and has to limp to a second place finish? Driver and team still showed up when it mattered.

There’s a reason why Gordon is mentioned in the same breath as Petty, Pearson and Dale, but Jimmie Johnson isn’t

What if a dominant ball sport team has their star player - the reason for their team's dominance - rupture an achilles in the championship, and the team loses? Bad luck, tough shit, the other team doesn't get an asterisk next to their Championship (not officially, anyway).

These things can happen in any professional sport. You haven't given a solid reason at all for a season-long points format with no playoff structure that makes any coherent sense or that is anything different than what happens in other professional sporting series/events. Your only reasoning is because "that's the way it was in the good ol days" or "that's the way motorsports is in the rest of the world". Terrible reasons. We're America, we don't give a damn about the rest of the world. They're wrong and we're right.

 

[fordman84]

You know damn well if that happened, NASCAR would stop the race and allow the championship 4 to re-enter the race in their backup cars on the lead lap

And don’t get me wrong, I still like the racing, and I think the current points system makes way more sense than the Winston Cup points, and I even like the idea of stages(just don’t see a reason for a caution, award the points and keep it moving). But the championship needs to be decided in a season long format like every other racing league from your local dirt track to F1 does

So what if they did like game show scoring and in the playoff rounds those races have each point 'reason' doubled from the previous? Then you can still have someone not win a race and still win it all.

 

[Illustrious Potentate]

What if a dominant ball sport team has their star player - the reason for their team's dominance - rupture an achilles in the championship, and the team loses? Bad luck, tough shit, the other team doesn't get an asterisk next to their Championship (not officially, anyway).

These things can happen in any professional sport. You haven't given a solid reason at all for a season-long points format with no playoff structure that makes any coherent sense or that is anything different than what happens in other professional sporting series/events. Your only reasoning is because "that's the way it was in the good ol days" or "that's the way motorsports is in the rest of the world". Terrible reasons. We're America, we don't give a damn about the rest of the world. They're wrong and we're right.

When your best player is a brittle bitch, better have depth.

But motorsports and ball sports are never gonna be a good comparison

It’s manufactured drama. If every World Series goes 7, game 7’s aren’t special. If every Super Bowl is an OT nail biter, OT nail biters aren’t special. Most any driver with a shot at winning a championship is gonna make the final 16. What’s the point of watching the first 26 races other than road courses and plate tracks where also rans have a shot to knock a more deserving driver out of the playoffs?

A championship in motorsports is always gonna be more impressive when it’s won under a season long format. You have to be good all season, you can’t back your way into a Mickey Mouse title like Logano is gonna do this year.

And if you’re gonna have a winner take all final race, it needs to be at a different track each year.

It is what it is, and it’s never gonna go back to being season long even though it makes NASCAR a novelty and a joke to fans of other racing leagues, but I don’t have to recognize it

 

[Mistaken4193]

Joey Logano would be 15th in points if this was still the Winston Cup days. And he is racing for a Championship. Meanwhile Chris Buescher would be 6th in the standings and he didn’t even make the fucking Playoffs.

Logano has 11 top 10s THIS WHOLE SEASON!! Only 6 top 5s. And he is racing for the fucking Championship. Joke

 

[Mistaken4193]

And just watched next year when SVG makes a deep run in the playoffs because of road course races despite finishing lower than 30th at all the Ovals.

 

[Illustrious Potentate]

And just watched next year when SVG makes a deep run in the playoffs because of road course races despite finishing lower than 30th at all the Ovals.

Harrison Burton was literally last place of any driver that started every race this season, and is gonna break Joe Nemechek’s record from 1999 for lowest full season points position for any driver to win a race and start every race in a season

 

[Schmoopy1000]

Playoff system has no place in auto sports. Ever.
The reason they have it is for money. Not champions.
They are trying to recreate the special 92 season where multiple drivers had a chance for the Championship going into the final race. So they made a joke of the championship by trying to recreate it un-naturally.
For those asking what if someone locks up the championship before the final race. Well that means they earned it. Auto sports (excluding Nascar) is one of the last sports you cant luck into. or get hot or whatever. It is a season long task.
For those asking about yeah but ball sports do it.
Yes & they have too. None of these sports has the same schedule. Even games where they play the same teams. Do you play the team at home or away. Do you play a team like GB in Sept. or Dec. Do you play that team while they are on a hot streak or cold streak. Do you play that team while they are healthy or while they are missing their star players. Ball sports are completely different scenario.
Motorsports. Everyone plays on the same field at the same time. If you are racing against a team on a hot streak or cold streak. Everyone is racing them against that streak. If you got to race against a team that dominates a certain track. Everyone has to race them at that track at the same time. if a driver gets hurt & cant race in a race. Every other driver gets that same advantage. Every schedule is the exact same & conditions are the exact same. All year long. You know who is the best that year. The guy with the most points. Dont need a gimmick to create a champion. Some team earned it. Under the exact same conditions as every other team in the sport.
Ball sports cant claim this. Some schedules are easier than others. Some might be luckier than others (timing of injuries ensech) A ton of variables between what one team did vs. another. So a playoff system was created.

Auto sports is a different animal & a playoff system has no business in creating a championship in this sport.

 

[Illustrious Potentate]

50 years too late, but NASCAR finally credited Bobby Allison with his 85th win that was robbed from him despite Tiny Lund having two wins that have always counted under the exact same circumstances(sportsman cars at small tracks)

He’s now 4th by himself on the all time win list. He’ll probably die happy being ahead of DW

 

[Schmoopy1000]

50 years too late, but NASCAR finally credited Bobby Allison with his 85th win that was robbed from him despite Tiny Lund having two wins that have always counted under the exact same circumstances(sportsman cars at small tracks)

He’s now 4th by himself on the all time win list. He’ll probably die happy being ahead of DW

until they give DW his win they gifted Brett Bodine. LOL

I remember that the Frances told DW you got lots of wins, just give this one to him.
I assume they didnt want to admit the mistake after the fact.
Bill France Sr. was big on the fans knowing who the winner is that night, not days later.

 

[Illustrious Potentate]

until they give DW his win they gifted Brett Bodine. LOL

I remember that the Frances told DW you got lots of wins, just give this one to him.
I assume they didnt want to admit the mistake after the fact.
Bill France Sr. was big on the fans knowing who the winner is that night, not days later.

Some dude made a video and did the math and concluded that Bodine was the rightful winner of the race. Good enough for me

 

[Illustrious Potentate]

Larson over driving and wrecking himself so often is why it’s hard for me to call him the best wheelman currently in NASCAR. Has the highest potential, but he spins himself out way too often and he’s the dirtiest driver on the track

 

[Mistaken4193]

Was a good race yesterday. I’m hopeful Reddick or Bell wins the championship so I can feel this season was legit