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Like the retired ones?
The Curse of Bob Nightengale
- Thread starter Bring Back The Oilers
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Nah, like the baseball-reference ones.
Murphy’s peak was great, but too short lived
Jones: 62.7 WAR in 8664 PA
Murphy: 46.5 WAR in 9041 PA
Jones has more than twice as many Wins Above Average.
Murphy was a better hitter but 10 points in OPS+ isn't that big of an advantage, especially when we're talking about one of the greatest defensive players of all-time.
Murphy: 46.5 WAR in 9041 PA
Jones has more than twice as many Wins Above Average.
Murphy was a better hitter but 10 points in OPS+ isn't that big of an advantage, especially when we're talking about one of the greatest defensive players of all-time.
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nothing gets boomers from the south goin' like Dale Murphy!
great player, but didn't have the longevity to be a HOFer
There's very little difference in Andruw's and Murphy's numbers on offense, while Andruw was significantly better on defense. They both had longevity issues, but Andruw was far more versatile during his prime than Murphy was.
Andruw Jones will probably suffer the same fate as Dale Murphy when it comes to being voted into the HOF. Andruw does have a stronger case, though.
great player, but didn't have the longevity to be a HOFer
There's very little difference in Andruw's and Murphy's numbers on offense, while Andruw was significantly better on defense. They both had longevity issues, but Andruw was far more versatile during his prime than Murphy was.
Andruw Jones will probably suffer the same fate as Dale Murphy when it comes to being voted into the HOF. Andruw does have a stronger case, though.
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Jones never had to carry a team & be the face of a franchise like Murphy did.
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Murphy got beaned by Tom Glavine and rightfully so
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Blasphemer!
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If you go to the Phillies or Mets, fuck you. I don’t like Glavine either
I was always a Bob Horner guy.
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Before my time, but looking at numbers, you have to wonder what he could have been if he wasn’t such a brittle bitch
There's no bigger organization of people who think their farts smell good than the BBWA. Ortiz was a personable guy and Bonds was a meanie poopoo face, that's the difference between why Ortiz gets votes and Bonds won't because all these boomer writers have fragile egos.
I mean, without PEDs, Bonds is in the Hall as baseball's only 500/500 player and Ortiz is basically the late aughts' version of Mo Vaughn.
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Ted Williams had 20 people not vote for him.
Nice take. So, following this, Bonds’ meanie poo poo face attitude is outweighed by the numbers when there is not the cheating excuse to keep him out?
I totally agree with the above….just want to make sure I’m following right.
At least then there was a quasi-excuse. There were 19 eventual HOFers on the ballot Williams got in on. At this point, any of the no-doubt guys should get 100% of the vote and be done with it.
There is absolutely zero reason to vote for Ortiz and not vote for Bonds. Any voter who does that should not be voting again next year. Papi owes way more of his success to juicing than Bonds does. Anyone who can vote for Ortiz but not Bonds isn't qualified to vote.
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And not a single one of them was better than Williams. Even Babe Ruth had people not vote for him.
15 years ago I was dead set against guys that it was clear juiced. Fuck them. Integrity matters.
This opinion has GREATLY moderated since then. I honestly think guys like Bonds and Clemens were on HoF trajectory before they presumably started juicing. Guys like Sosa and Palmiero….maybe not so much. So, a great way to put this era behind us is to at least let in the guys that were likely on this track anyway.
As it goes with the BBWA making the votes….fuck the living fuck out of this. That’s the same opinion I’ve had for a long time (unlike the juice era). I sometimes play the “If I were made the sports czar” (yeah, it’s a Bill Simmons idea…and a fun idea to play with).
This has always been the first change I would make….fuck you writers making these calls. You’re out.
I don’t know if I can say who owes more to juicing, but I think I get what you’re saying. Bonds was absolutely on the track to HoF before he even started. Papi was a no body.
It’s a god damn Student Council vote….that’s all it is.
This doesn't mean that someone was "better" than Williams or whatever, just that the HOF voters used to have a legitimate excuse to say, "Oh, it's suck if Al Lopez fell off the ballot because everyone voted for Williams."
I don't agree with the logic, but at least it's defensible. There aren't five guys on this ballot, including PED users, that are surefire locks, so the guys now that come through and are all-time greats (Adrian Beltre, come on down) should be getting 100% of the vote. I don't care what writers did in the 50s when you were starting your first job.