Do FSU & Clemson Have A Landing Spot?

Deep Creek said:
Don’t you think greed entered the equation a long time ago? Or, at least the pursuit of greed?
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I guess what I meant is that greed is going to present itself in very new and unexpected ways.

Once the P2 gets solidified it won't be long before they make a move to remove the NCAA out of the equation altogether and form an alliance to take over March Madness. That is a billion dollars a year just sitting out there that the conferences eventually are going to want for themselves. I could see where the P2, ACC and Big 12 create an alliance to share/control the revenue and have allotted spots for other conferences to participate but not have ownership.

They could go alone without inviting other schools but they will at least try.
 
Wild Turkey said:
I guess what I meant is that greed is going to present itself in very new and unexpected ways.

Once the P2 gets solidified it won't be long before they make a move to remove the NCAA out of the equation altogether and form an alliance to take over March Madness. That is a billion dollars a year just sitting out there that the conferences eventually are going to want for themselves. I could see where the P2, ACC and Big 12 create an alliance to share/control the revenue and have allotted spots for other conferences to participate but not have ownership.

They could go alone without inviting other schools but they will at least try.
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I've been saying that about March Madness for a while. But, the House settlement will set that back for at least 10 years. That's the good part of House for the smaller conferences.

That said, I can see the P4 doing that and it still being a really fun tournament. I mean does anyone really think if the were to go to 96 teams that would make it less enjoyable?
 
WhosYourDawggy said:
It would take too many have-nots to change the by-laws, so that isn't happening.

I just think too many people don't stop to think what makes CFB great. It's not a super conference. This is why the super league soccer thing didn't work, and won't work with CFB.
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I don't disagree but like I said greed makes people do strange things and at some point the scenario I laid out will become part of the conversation. It just seems inevitable. In today's world money is trumping everything else in college football.

The presidents will probably get on board as well because if their school can be one of the members in the "Super Conference" that generates a tremendous amount of revenue and keeps their enrollment as high as they can handle.
 
www.outkick.com

Greg Sankey Takes Shot At Florida State Over 2023 'Unconquered' Season

SEC Commissioner Greg Sankey took a shot at Florida State and their 2023 football season celebrations and suggested they
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"Georgia was one of the best four teams (in the country) and didn’t get in (to the playoff), but you didn’t see us jumping up and down and complaining and hanging national championship banners," Sankey said.
 
www.si.com

College football realignment: UNC, Virginia to SEC more likely than Clemson, Florida State

While college football realignment remains a key issue this preseason, the SEC has no desire to expand, with Greg Sankey notably shooting down the idea of Flori
www.si.com www.si.com

Chris Low thinks IF the time comes the SEC would be more interested in UNC and Virginia because of new markets, academia and basketball then they would ClemU and FSU. If that’s true then ClemU appears fucked imo.
 
ralphiewvu said:
www.si.com

College football realignment: UNC, Virginia to SEC more likely than Clemson, Florida State

While college football realignment remains a key issue this preseason, the SEC has no desire to expand, with Greg Sankey notably shooting down the idea of Flori
www.si.com www.si.com

Chris Low thinks IF the time comes the SEC would be more interested in UNC and Virginia because of new markets, academia and basketball then they would ClemU and FSU. If that’s true then ClemU appears fucked imo.
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College Sports Dancing GIF by Clemson Tigers
 
ralphiewvu said:
www.si.com

College football realignment: UNC, Virginia to SEC more likely than Clemson, Florida State

While college football realignment remains a key issue this preseason, the SEC has no desire to expand, with Greg Sankey notably shooting down the idea of Flori
www.si.com www.si.com

Chris Low thinks IF the time comes the SEC would be more interested in UNC and Virginia because of new markets, academia and basketball then they would ClemU and FSU. If that’s true then ClemU appears fucked imo.
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The "market" thing makes zero sense economically.

The problem with FSU and Clemson is that ESPN already has them at a discount price. Why pay more and move them to the SEC. Also, if we look at markets, Clemson and FSU don't bring market to the SEC, they do to the B1G.

I'll say it again ... the only teams that can come close to paying their own way and earning a full share are ND, Clemson, and FSU. I can't imagine SEC teams being willing to give up 5 million each to bring in UNC and UVa.

Not go after two of that league's big football brands? There's more to it than just football, Low suggests.

"There's other factors at play here," he said. "New footprints. You get the state of North Carolina, the state of Virginia. Both academically elite schools. You have the basketball factor. You get a little bit of the Charlotte TV market, maybe a little bit of the D.C. market."

None of that makes any sense. It's all about football and markets don't really matter, and even if the did it's what NC and VA can do to raise the amount they get paid for the SEC network in those two states. It's not about 2 cities. Low really has no idea.

Plus UNC has the NCSU problem.
 
WhosYourDawggy said:
The "market" thing makes zero sense economically.

The problem with FSU and Clemson is that ESPN already has them at a discount price. Why pay more and move them to the SEC. Also, if we look at markets, Clemson and FSU don't bring market to the SEC, they do to the B1G.

I'll say it again ... the only teams that can come close to paying their own way and earning a full share are ND, Clemson, and FSU. I can't imagine SEC teams being willing to give up 5 million each to bring in UNC and UVa.

Not go after two of that league's big football brands? There's more to it than just football, Low suggests.

"There's other factors at play here," he said. "New footprints. You get the state of North Carolina, the state of Virginia. Both academically elite schools. You have the basketball factor. You get a little bit of the Charlotte TV market, maybe a little bit of the D.C. market."

None of that makes any sense. It's all about football and markets don't really matter, and even if the did it's what NC and VA can do to raise the amount they get paid for the SEC network in those two states. It's not about 2 cities. Low really has no idea.

Plus UNC has the NCSU problem.
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Honestly I think it’s for the 2030’s. There is zero doubt in my mind ESPN doesn’t reup. It’s stupid not to. Which likely means anyone that wants to defect from the ACC now isn’t going to do it cheaply or for free. Revisiting that GoR with 6 years left is a lot different than with 11 years left?
 


Looks like both are expected to be in the ACC for the 25/26 seasons.
 
ericd7633 said:

Looks like both are expected to be in the ACC for the 25/26 seasons.
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And 27, 28, 29...

There will eventually be a point where the cost to leave becomes manageable. However CFB success can fluctuate and there is no guarantee either are the crown jewel they are today - so what seems like a good bet today may not be by 2030. Maybe VT starts kicking everyone's ass and they become the school everyone is after. Maybe Miami finally gets back to prominence. What if Stanford, Cal, or SMU start beating the rest down?

Also, this court business is going to drag out excruciatingly for these two schools, and then the appeals by the losing side will drag out. Meanwhile the P2 will not be interested in adding any team embroiled in a lawsuit, nevermind a team whose media rights are in question.

As for AAU status, that's by invite. It is not some threshold to be reached per se, it is a group of other schools that get to vote on allowing another into their club based on criteria the Presidents look at. And these Presidents are really serious about it, too. I saw a list of items FSU needs to work on last year when they were voted down, it looked like it would take a few years to correct, not something they could just change quickly.

Forget about the Twitter and YouTube talking heads, they are just seeking clicks. The ACC is going to be intact for another several years.
 
rfjeff9 said:
And 27, 28, 29...

There will eventually be a point where the cost to leave becomes manageable. However CFB success can fluctuate and there is no guarantee either are the crown jewel they are today - so what seems like a good bet today may not be by 2030. Maybe VT starts kicking everyone's ass and they become the school everyone is after. Maybe Miami finally gets back to prominence. What if Stanford, Cal, or SMU start beating the rest down?

Also, this court business is going to drag out excruciatingly for these two schools, and then the appeals by the losing side will drag out. Meanwhile the P2 will not be interested in adding any team embroiled in a lawsuit, nevermind a team whose media rights are in question.

As for AAU status, that's by invite. It is not some threshold to be reached per se, it is a group of other schools that get to vote on allowing another into their club based on criteria the Presidents look at. And these Presidents are really serious about it, too. I saw a list of items FSU needs to work on last year when they were voted down, it looked like it would take a few years to correct, not something they could just change quickly.

Forget about the Twitter and YouTube talking heads, they are just seeking clicks. The ACC is going to be intact for another several years.
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AAU is also the kind of snobby group that might be turned off by adding someone who is obnoxiously trying to get in. Sort of like Augusta National. You are less likely to get in if you want to join Augusta National. That is why Ted Turner isn't a member. He went public with wanting an invite, and they told him to fuck off.
 
WhosYourDawggy said:
The "market" thing makes zero sense economically.

The problem with FSU and Clemson is that ESPN already has them at a discount price. Why pay more and move them to the SEC. Also, if we look at markets, Clemson and FSU don't bring market to the SEC, they do to the B1G.

"There's other factors at play here," he said. "New footprints. You get the state of North Carolina, the state of Virginia. Both academically elite schools. You have the basketball factor. You get a little bit of the Charlotte TV market, maybe a little bit of the D.C. market."

None of that makes any sense. It's all about football and markets don't really matter, and even if the did it's what NC and VA can do to raise the amount they get paid for the SEC network in those two states. It's not about 2 cities. Low really has no idea.

Plus UNC has the NCSU problem.
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Why are we talking "markets". You and I both agree it is about viewership these days. Not markets. No?
 
WhosYourDawggy said:
AAU is also the kind of snobby group that might be turned off by adding someone who is obnoxiously trying to get in. Sort of like Augusta National. You are less likely to get in if you want to join Augusta National. That is why Ted Turner isn't a member. He went public with wanting an invite, and they told him to fuck off.
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typically AAU schools get bigger research money or something IIRC
 
Deep Creek said:
Why are we talking "markets". You and I both agree it is about viewership these days. Not markets. No?
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That's why I said, "The "market" thing makes zero sense economically." I then pointed out that their market analysis, even if it mattered, was flawed. It's not a particular city; it's the state.

But yes, we agree markets are so 2012.
 
Thiefery said:
typically AAU schools get bigger research money or something IIRC
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There is no doubt AAU matters - they drive way more money in research dollars than college sports do.

Here is a top 20 list:

Johns Hopkins University: $1.3 billion
Georgia Institute of Technology: $936 million
SUNY, Polytechnic Institute: $412 million
Texas A&M University., College Station and Health Science Center: $403 million
Massachusetts Institute of Technology: $398 million
Pennsylvania State University, University Park and Hershey Medical Center: $386 million
University of Texas: $320 million
Purdue University: $312 million
University of Michigan: $299 million
Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University: $260 million
Utah State University: $259 million
University of Illinois: $229 million
Wichita State University: $226 million
Ohio State University: $219 million
University of California, San Diego: $213 million
University of California, Berkeley: $207 million
University of Dayton: $196 million
Arizona State University: $193 million
University of Colorado: $192 million
University of Washington: $172 million

All those dollars are way more than even the top school gets in athletics. That's why AAU is important ... for good or bad, research dollars is the life blood of universities.
 
WhosYourDawggy said:
There is no doubt AAU matters - they drive way more money in research dollars than college sports do.

Here is a top 20 list:

Johns Hopkins University: $1.3 billion
Georgia Institute of Technology: $936 million
SUNY, Polytechnic Institute: $412 million
Texas A&M University., College Station and Health Science Center: $403 million
Massachusetts Institute of Technology: $398 million
Pennsylvania State University, University Park and Hershey Medical Center: $386 million
University of Texas: $320 million
Purdue University: $312 million
University of Michigan: $299 million
Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University: $260 million
Utah State University: $259 million
University of Illinois: $229 million
Wichita State University: $226 million
Ohio State University: $219 million
University of California, San Diego: $213 million
University of California, Berkeley: $207 million
University of Dayton: $196 million
Arizona State University: $193 million
University of Colorado: $192 million
University of Washington: $172 million

All those dollars are way more than even the top school gets in athletics. That's why AAU is important ... for good or bad, research dollars is the life blood of universities.
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Yep. And IIRC, the universities can often charge grants up to 40-50% administrative cost fees! So only 50-60% actually gets to the end point.
 
duckboy33 said:
By 2026...

I was thought it would happen by the 2026 season.
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In your thinking do you believe they will:

1. Defeat GOR in court
2. Pony up the 500mm to buy themselves out
3. Believe the conference will fold on their position and negotiate a lesser amount?

I'll be honest I don't see 1 or 2 happening anytime soon and I would be shocked if they can come up with 500mm.
 
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