Lawn Care Advice Thread

I'm in the same boat. If you aren't going to go full on reno and start from scratch, you may be looking at two full years of over seeding and all of the weeds that will come with it. Even a full reno has a ton of weeds the first season because you can't both fully prevent them, and not hurt your grass seeds.

Unless you have the money to do sod.

Weeds just aren't that big of a deal. Well, as long as you don't ignore them and let them go for years or something.
 
Go to the nearest agricultural college website in your area and find out what type of soil you have by applying for a soil testing kit. They can tell you what your ph is and which grasses grow best at that ph and your soil conditions. They may even recommend some soil treatments you may need after reviewing your samples. LSU did it for me. Grass grows pretty easy here but so do weeds and unwanted grasses. I went with centipede and used some carpet grass seed with it to help it cover the soil. that's what you want to do....cover every dirt spot with either grass or light straw over new seedings.
 
Bayou Tiger said:
Go to the nearest agricultural college website in your area and find out what type of soil you have by applying for a soil testing kit. They can tell you what your ph is and which grasses grow best at that ph and your soil conditions. They may even recommend some soil treatments you may need after reviewing your samples. LSU did it for me. Grass grows pretty easy here but so do weeds and unwanted grasses. I went with centipede and used some carpet grass seed with it to help it cover the soil. that's what you want to do....cover every dirt spot with either grass or light straw over new seedings.
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Oh, absolutely get a soil test if there are places that struggle. I plan to do that for a couple areas that didn't thicken up as much as I would've liked from the fall overseed, but they were also around a few oak trees and on a slope that are also likely issues. I've since had the trees trimmed with their canopies elevated, so hoping to see how those areas do with more sun, air, and hopefully a little less water taken up by the trees. I will be overseeding again this fall anyway, but do want to see if there are soil issues in those areas so I can help correct them.

Since I live in VA, either cool or warm grass type can grow, but not necessarily to their full potential compared to further north of south. Notorious for clay soil that needs lime and aeration consistently, but soil tests will help determine how much to add to keep ph in the 6.2-7 range.

My soil temps are just now getting into the low-mid 60s, so my cool season grass should start to take off as it continues to warm until soil temps edge to 80. The weeds are yellowing and dying back after the 2,4D and I'm looking for a good rain the next 24 hours to have the grass really start to overtake the remnants of the weeds until they decompose completely. That should help with the overall color of the yard.

We all want to see instant results, but I always have to remind myself that it took years of neglect to get this way and it's going to take years to correct. Especially with 90% of the neighbors content with mowing/scalping weeds without worrying about improving, so it'll always be a struggle. My really weedy spots are bordering the neighbors or along the water drainage ditch. I am seeing progress throughout, with the main goal of thickening through overseeding for a couple falls, then work on talking the fall/winter germinating weeds.
 
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To follow up regarding soil tests, there are some you can do at home that would be similar to using litmus paper. You can compare the color to the box's chart to give you an "idea" of where you stand with ph and other nutrient levels. However, they're not that accurate and don't provide details to correct.

As @Bayou Tiger mentioned, you can contact your local county extension office for a test kit that will be sent in to the nearest agricultural university to test (Virginia Tech or Virginia State University in my state) for a small fee. You'll likely need to clean a trowel and dig down several inches of the areas you want to test, then send it off. Your results will tell you where you stand versus nominal levels with recommendations on what to add and how much in order to bring any deficiencies into level.

Spring is a really busy time for them, as they're working with a lot of farms and then other homeowners, so it may take longer to get results to be effective at this point in the spring. I'd wait to send it off until the summer (July) so that you can get results back in time to add amendments in the fall so they can break down and work themselves into the soil throughout the winter for next year.
 
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@Cobrabit - Bit of a Poa Annua update:
So far I'm not seeing even one sprout of Poa in the roughly 5x4 foot area I worked on last summer/fall. The only reason I'm willing to say that now is there are a couple of small ones fully formed with seed heads right up the border of my driveway that I clearly missed.

This surprises me. I did not expect that much progress at all. Was hoping for 60% reduction maybe. I really have no explanation for why it is this good given that with my over seeding last fall I was not able to put a pre emergent down for Poa. I either got lucky, or Tenacity does more as a pre emergent against Poa than their label indicates?

Just as a refresher, what I did:
Ran a heavy over spray in the area twice, two weeks apart. I was willing to sacrifice good grass to take the Poa down as far as I could. Despite both doses being heavier than label amounts, the good grass came through fine. Went a little lime green for a bit, but I did this sort of summer time and it all bounced back fully going into fall.

I aggressively raked the area to pull up as much of the dead Poa as I could to leave as much exposed soil as possible for over seeding.

I believe it was less than a month later that I over seeded and was pretty aggressive in seeding that area, still it is among the least dense of that part of the front yard, but still not even one Poa in that area.

It's really weird. Even more so because I core aerated before seeding which should have exposed even more dormant Poa seeds.

I'm also not really seeing any in other areas of the yard that I was not aggressive on, but still did a normal pass of Tenacity. I had some in my back yard which is a dog run I don't really do much to, and some near a fence that I had not really spent time on and neither have anything as of yet.

Now we are still in very cold temps, but they should have germinated last fall and be visible even if partially dormant.

Seriously, our avg daily soil temp is showing under 50 still. This is an unseasonably cold start to spring. I haven't done anything to the lawn outside of one early mow and ran the sunjoe over it at level (no sub surface) to pull up moss and winter dead grass. Sending off a soil test today and still won't put tenacity out until the soil temp gets closer to 55.

The lawn is still looking decent without doing anything. That BBU survived its first winter quite well and held the color. Now if we could just get some damned rain a bit of warmup it would have more time to get ready for its first hot summer.
 
Oh, forgot one step that might also help explain it come to think of it. I top dressed probably a half inch while over seeding. Possible most of the Poa is too deep now to easily germinate.
 
Wizardhawk said:
Oh, forgot one step that might also help explain it come to think of it. I top dressed probably a half inch while over seeding. Possible most of the Poa is too deep now to easily germinate.
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One thing with herbicide companies is that they may not say their product controls a particular seed unless it meets their high standards. Doesn't mean that it isn't at least somewhat effective. You may have a!so bad enough of a tenacity layer down when that POA was starting to germinate last year to knock out some of them, even with the aeration.

Like you, I'd like to see how it does when temps warm up a little in your area for a true result.

I've got some Prodiamine 65WG I plan to spray down in the next few weeks for my second spring pre-emergent app once soil temps get in that 65-70 range. Probably will be around the time for another fertilizer all as well.
 
Funny that I mentioned earlier how most of my neighbors don't do anything, but my next door neighbor brought home a rented aerator an hour ago and is pulling some plugs now. Not sure if he's planning on seeding with rain in the forecast, but I'll keep any eye out. Unfortunately, I think he'll be disappointed with the result, as I think he's just creating a weed heaven (couldn't be worse than it currently is I guess) and if he does seed, they're likely to die out in a couple months.
 
Neighbor just asked me to help him load the aerator back up after finishing. He does plan to throw down some seed. My wife thinks that his got on him a little bit, because she was commenting on how nice our yard looked the other day when the wives chatted for an hour outside. Yes, I know it's still got a way to go, but that does help stroke the ego a little bit.

Did let him know he can borrow my tow behind aerator anytime instead of renting a walk behind.
 
Cobrabit said:
One thing with herbicide companies is that they may not say their product controls a particular seed unless it meets their high standards. Doesn't mean that it isn't at least somewhat effective. You may have a!so bad enough of a tenacity layer down when that POA was starting to germinate last year to knock out some of them, even with the aeration.

Like you, I'd like to see how it does when temps warm up a little in your area for a true result.

I've got some Prodiamine 65WG I plan to spray down in the next few weeks for my second spring pre-emergent app once soil temps get in that 65-70 range. Probably will be around the time for another fertilizer all as well.
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I know Poa seeds can survive for more than a decade so I by no means think that area is good forever. It does mean I'm going to be hitting the over seed when it warms up a bit and working toward getting a pre emergent down in that area come fall, even if I may need some help in other areas. Once I have the Poa on the ropes I really don't intend to let it spark back up again.
 
Wizardhawk said:
I know Poa seeds can survive for more than a decade so I by no means think that area is good forever. It does mean I'm going to be hitting the over seed when it warms up a bit and working toward getting a pre emergent down in that area come fall, even if I may need some help in other areas. Once I have the Poa on the ropes I really don't intend to let it spark back up again.
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Sounds like a plan. I'll probably hit the POA areas with pre-emergent in the fall and over seed everything else, especially since its only in a 500 sq ft area. The drainage in those areas are poor due to the rain runoff channels from the neighbors, so it's not a top priority, while everything else is for the kids to play in and entertain in the backyard.
 
outofyourmind said:
That's a great idea.
Does it look something like this.



View attachment 26602
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Without looking it up, it does look like my Agrifab model. I've also got the dethatcher that I'll use every few years that I'd be willing to lend out as well. Figured that it'll pay for itself in a couple uses.
 
Anyone used Ironite by Pennington? My first time using it and seems like a product that would be good during the summer for cool season grasses to maintain color without a lot of growth or deepening color at other times. I bought a few bags a few weeks back and decided to mix some with some Scott's lawn food I got for $5/bag last year essentially as a 50/50 mix to throw down yesterday.

While I put down the bag rate for each (essentially 0.8 lbs N/1000 sqft for the fertilizer), as I'm okay pushing the grass every 4-6 weeks during its high points to develop roots and thickness prior to summer, I plan to decrease the nitrogen to iron ratio during the summer months to maintain color, but not increase stress with too much growth from the nitrogen.

Hoping to go to a more organic setup within the next year or so for fertilizers, but have plenty of Scott's to use up these next several months with their every season lawn food, their summerguard, and I used the lawn food with halts a month ago. (Will spray prodiamine once soil temps stay in the 65-70 degree range in the next few weeks for a second app of pre-emergent).

Plenty of other options I'm looking into outside of the biggest name brands once I deplete my stock of Scott's. While I've got some 12-12-12 from Rural King I'll use as a starter fertilizer during overseeding around Labor Day this year, I've got an app of Milorganite in storage I got on sale to use next year.


So overall, I've got a stock of Scott's to use up this year through the overseeding, but will be looking for a fall/winter fertilizer to continue to push root development (soil warmer than air temps) where I've used Jonathan Green winter fertilizer before (10-0-20). I liked that winterizer, but am open to other options, along with options for next year for a more organic (soil microbe) program.
 
Cobrabit said:
Anyone used Ironite by Pennington?
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Years ago I did.
Can't say that I even noticed it greening better. Might have been the application rate or something,.


If I want Iron now, I just buy it already in the fertilizer, like with 2% Iron or 5% Iron. I see way better results that way and faster, but I have bermuda so not sure about fescue
 
outofyourmind said:
Years ago I did.
Can't say that I even noticed it greening better. Might have been the application rate or something,.


If I want Iron now, I just buy it already in the fertilizer, like with 2% Iron or 5% Iron. I see way better results that way and faster, but I have bermuda so not sure about fescue
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Thanks for the insight. I took some pictures immediately after applying to compare in a couple weeks, however, with the fertilizer, there wouldn't be a completely fair analysis since both were applied over the entire yard. Even though Scott's fertilizer with halts was applied 5 weeks prior, I wasn't setting it up as a direct test, rather a "wouldn't hurt" mentality.

I have seen a YouTube video that did a comparison of ironite versus milorganite on approximately a 100 sq ft section each and the ironite was faster to deeper green and held it longer.

I'll probably use it for the summer months mainly, if at all, after seeing if it does anything, but will likely switch to a fertilizer that incorporates more iron like you mentioned once I deplete the current stock.

What do you currently use? I've been looking at the lawn care nut's fertilizers that use organics similar to milorganite as fillers instead of the cheap ingredients brand names use. So you'd supposedly get the added benefit of biostimulants also and there's some offered with additional iron.
 
Cobrabit said:
What do you currently use? I've been looking at the lawn care nut's fertilizers that use organics similar to milorganite
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I've tried Ironite, Milorganite, Scotts, all of it.
I have bermuda and none of that does much vs 10-20-10 or 34-0-0 that I use now, plus a pre-emergent 4 times a year.

It greens up great, and fast, and don't have that many weeds.
 
Cobrabit said:
Anyone used Ironite by Pennington? My first time using it and seems like a product that would be good during the summer for cool season grasses to maintain color without a lot of growth or deepening color at other times. I bought a few bags a few weeks back and decided to mix some with some Scott's lawn food I got for $5/bag last year essentially as a 50/50 mix to throw down yesterday.

While I put down the bag rate for each (essentially 0.8 lbs N/1000 sqft for the fertilizer), as I'm okay pushing the grass every 4-6 weeks during its high points to develop roots and thickness prior to summer, I plan to decrease the nitrogen to iron ratio during the summer months to maintain color, but not increase stress with too much growth from the nitrogen.

Hoping to go to a more organic setup within the next year or so for fertilizers, but have plenty of Scott's to use up these next several months with their every season lawn food, their summerguard, and I used the lawn food with halts a month ago. (Will spray prodiamine once soil temps stay in the 65-70 degree range in the next few weeks for a second app of pre-emergent).

Plenty of other options I'm looking into outside of the biggest name brands once I deplete my stock of Scott's. While I've got some 12-12-12 from Rural King I'll use as a starter fertilizer during overseeding around Labor Day this year, I've got an app of Milorganite in storage I got on sale to use next year.


So overall, I've got a stock of Scott's to use up this year through the overseeding, but will be looking for a fall/winter fertilizer to continue to push root development (soil warmer than air temps) where I've used Jonathan Green winter fertilizer before (10-0-20). I liked that winterizer, but am open to other options, along with options for next year for a more organic (soil microbe) program.
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I've used ironite, but not extensively. I've also used liquid apps which I think have lasted longer. I don't use it often because I really don't need it for soil conditions and there are better ways of getting green that seems to last longer without all the risks of staining that come with iron.

It also depends on your soil PH and grass type. It has more impact on Fescue and bluegrass than any of the warm season grasses and doesn't seem to do as much to the rye I have. Also alkaline soil causes iron deficiency so adding iron can really change the color, but bringing the soil back into balance will do so and with more benefit.

Since you have the TTTF you should see impact from it fairly quickly. Wouldn't expect it to last more than a week or so though, at least that was my experience.

Milorganite is my go to when I need color and I'm not really in need of anything else. You can't over apply it, won't burn or cause problems, can go in flower beds and around trees with no issues, doesn't stain, is pet/kid friendly, doesn't matter if it is watered in, etc... What little iron that is in it doesn't really impact the color IMO, it's more the nitrogen and since it's not in a salt form it's so much better for the lawn.

We are finally starting to warm up a bit. Should reach 55 avg soil temp by this weekend. I have a soil sample out that I should get results on soon, but in the meantime I'll likely wake the yard up with milo this weekend and get some tenacity out on the early weeds.

I'm predicting my soil report to say my PH is a bit low, but not by much and possibly my K as well. Since milo has no salts I will still be free to put a 10-0-10 or something similar down relatively close to that app without any issues.

Heck, I will only have my second mow of the season this weekend as well. It's been so damned cold.
 
Yard was greening up and cranking along, but it's going to only be in the 50's for highs the next week.
Probably slow it up a little.
 
No huge surprises in my soil test and it came out about where I expected.

Since the topic of Iron and Milorganite came up, my tests showed I am near the top range for Iron and fairly near the top for Phosphorous, both of which are in Milo. And that's after having last put some down mid summer last year. So if you put down 1 or 2 apps of Milo each year you probably won't see any benefit from also putting Iron down separately as the Fe content of the soil will already be fairly high.

N is a bit low, but looks like the fall dose still left some into early spring. My potassium is so low I'm going to have to hit the yard with 0-0-60. This is a by-product of sticking with just Milo for much of the program as it has zero in it. I know people are switching back and forth alternating with one app of Milo, and then one of a 10-0-6 organic and I may need to do the same. My K is so low I'm going to hit a 10-0-6 and half bag rate of 0-0-60.

PH is also low as expected, but then heavy rain areas always are acidic. I did put lime down last year but still my PH is around 5 right now. Going to put some mag-i-cal down now and hit another app of lime this fall.

The sodium content of my soil is near the bottom end of the target range. I only use an inorganic fert once a year and really don't add anything else that puts salts down. I think a lot of people that use big box store ferts and just go heavy to try to fix their lawns end up with very high levels and more yellowing which just makes them want to put even more down.
 
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