Clemson Joins FSU in Suing the ACC To Get Out of Media Rights

Rutgers isn’t in the same convo now, and has never been. But they are getting paid like they are. And even more than a couple of them for a few years.
and thats my point. why pick Rutgers who has been making money but will never have a chance at the playoff vs Oklahoma State who has just as good a chance to make it?
why go to Rutgers to have a chance at 8 wins (their most in a season in the Big) and their 2 bowl wins out of 3 bowls since joining the Big vs Oklahoma State who in the same time frame has 5 double digit win seasons, 7 bowl wins, 2 of were NY6, would have made expanded playoff a couple times and now doesnt have Oklahoma and Texas to deal with?
 
Look at the list of Big 12 schools. The Big 12 doesn't have any real measurable separation among the schools. At least as far as drawing viewership which brings increased revenue. IIRC, the only school that drew good ratings was Colorado because of the Prime hype. And how long will that last?

Who would you consider the "top" half of the Big 12 for them to grab?

As far as the remaining Texas teams go, the SEC would have grabbed them if they'd of had enough value.

Basketball is a factor too though. There's enough decent football and good basketball programs in the Big 12 to link up with ACC schools to make a solid overall conference that could be appealing to networks. It won't be the same as P2 value, but it would closer and certainly better than what they stand to make now. If they stand pat, the gap in revenue is so large they will easily be irrelevant
 
ACC would have had the venue stipulated as the state most advantageous to the league, which I'm guessing is the state of origin.

A lot of times you'll see these things come up in Delaware courts.
Based on the ACC filing in NC, we can assume that the agreement specifies NC as the venue for lawsuits. You are correct about Deleware ... I believe that the B12 has Deleware as their jurisdiction.
 
FSU filed in Florida and neither Clemson or FSU want this tried in NC.

I’ve seen legal opinions on this (from attorneys that know what they are talking about) and venue is going to be a huge deal potentially fought in multiple states.

Estimates are it will take a year.
As an attorney, I can tell you that one of the more interesting classes in law school was Conflicts of Law. At least to me. That's a whole class about what they are going to argue about. It will be argued, and it will be appealed. At least a year or two just to determine jurisdiction.
 
As an attorney, I can tell you that one of the more interesting classes in law school was Conflicts of Law. At least to me. That's a whole class about what they are going to argue about. It will be argued, and it will be appealed. At least a year or two just to determine jurisdiction.
oh man you are an attorney? Shoot.. save me a seat in the suites when we play in Atlanta for the SEC championship :)
 
The “magnificent 7” as they are being called are supposedly the ones moving on. My guesses/reasons would be:

FSU- SEC, BIG wants a footprint in Florida and FSU would be a great get for the BIG but I think the SEC is going to step in here for its own good and get imo the better brand in FSU and let the BIG have Miami and their market & academics.

Clemson - SEC , Clemson is a good brand and would be a good asset for either of the power 2 but I think Clemson playing SEC schools will bring more eyeballs than Clemson playing BIG schools and I think all parties involved will agree so..

Miami - BIG for reasons above ^ , this move will be good for both parties imo.

UNC- BIG , the SEC would LOVE to have UNC but I think UNC covets the academic (albeit fraudulent , they have been proven an academic fraud recently) reputation and status and… I’m not sure UNC wants any part of the SEC on football Saturdays tbh.

NC State- BIG by way of being connected at the hip to UNC and , BIG gets another huge footprint in another coastal state like they did in California.

UVA - BIG , gets it’s footprint in VA and they get the academics that the BIG likes.

VT- SEC , SEC gets into Virginia , VT gets a huge shot in the arm.

Having said all that, those are the schools mentioned (who knows how true it is really) as the seven who have been examining the GOR for loopholes believing that they have homes in the Big2 waiting for them.
VT may well get left out to dry and Duke may be in play somewhere in all this. They may possibly be a get for the SEC :noidea:

I also believe that Notre Dame will join the BIG for its own survival once this all starts shaking out as well, particularly if the BIG gets FSU, that would be some very seriou$ brand power should they pull those moves off.

As far as the ACC leftovers and Big12, I’m not sure what to expect TBH. I know that a lot of WVU folk would jump at the chance to join even what’s left of the ACC IF the money is similar to what the Big12 is getting them now and you could save some money by reducing some of the travel costs of being in the Big12 but.. no idea what the money would look like after sustaining those kinds of loses by the ACC and not sure how UCF/Cincy feel about that move. It’s going to be a huge financial haircut for the refugee ACC schools for sure. Maybe the Big12 leftovers and ACC leftovers merge :noidea:
So if the 7 leave thats 10 remaining.
and if WVU Cinci UCF were interested in jumping (add another school like Memphis for even numbers)
could that open Big Xii to add Oregon State and Washington State and a third like Tulane?
 
USC when they suck
empty-la-coliseum-vs-ua.jpeg
television eyeballs not attendance ones. Why did the B1G want USC? Or UCLA?
 

This article is basically what I've been saying in that UNC is the school everyone wants.
The true prize reportedly might be in North Carolina. See "might be"

Then, "However, the most important brand is apparently in Chapel Hill." Yet, nowhere in the article do they point out why that is the brand everyone wants when we all know this is driven by football money, something that UNC does not deliver in any way.

If you dig down into the article, he cites an article I read by Ross Dellenger. Here is what he had to say:

“North Carolina,” said an industry source, “is the lynchpin.”

About 5 paragraphs later, this is all he says:

"The Tar Heels remain the lynchpin to the ACC’s future. They are a charter member of the conference, reside in its geographic center, boast an impressive academic reputation, and are arguably the conference’s most valuable brand, from both a football and basketball perspective as well as Olympic sports."

No mention of the finances that UNC doesn't bring, although he later says, "Football-related TV distribution is the primary revenue driver for most major college athletic departments." UNC doesn't drive any revenue there.

In discussing where Clemson and FSU would land, schools that bring way more football revenue to the table, Dellenger says:

"It is unlikely that any SEC or Big Ten school will agree to accept a reduction in their TV distribution to add any school. For the SEC, that is especially so given its footprint: the league already owns a foothold in South Carolina and in Florida. Also, the SEC programs in those states would likely make a fuss, if they haven’t already, over inviting into the league their arch-rivals (See: Texas A&M’s reaction to the SEC inviting Texas).

In order for the Big Ten and SEC to expand, they’d likely need more money from their television partners — a lot more money (more than $100 million a year). That’s primarily Fox for the Big Ten and ESPN for the SEC. There is one problem with this.

There isn’t as much money in the market as there once was,” said a conference official with knowledge of the networks’ dealings."


Basically, he is acknowledging that football revenue drives the decisions. No SEC or B1G team is going to take a cut. The team coming in has to bring in $100 million in actual value, and the TV partners aren't going to just pony that up as there isn't as much in the market as there used to be. None of that bodes well for UNC to be the "lynchpin" of anything. The only thing UNC has going for it is (1) academic prestige (the SEC doesn't care), (2) Olympic sports (the SEC doesn't care), and (3) a new market that is not important now and less so in the future.

Now throw in that the NC legislature has taken the decision to move conferences out of the schools' hands and put them into the UNC System Board of Governors' hands, which means UNC is going anywhere without NC State. The SEC and the B1G don't want NCState, and there is no reason to be optimistic that UNC has a place to land.

However, in January, a new policy change in the state of North Carolina adds a wrinkle to any realignment. The UNC System Board of Governors voted to give the system president and itself final authority over a school changing conferences. The policy now requires the school chancellor to provide notice and a financial plan for a school’s potential conference exit.

The Board of Governors has authority over both North Carolina and NC State. Does this mean NC State and UNC are a package deal if they are to leave the ACC? Perhaps.

North Carolina Gov. Roy Cooper believes the two should not compete in separate conferences.

“I would hope that would not happen and that would not be good for our state,” he said earlier this year.


I have a son who graduated from UNC and one who is in medical school at UNC, and I would love to have SEC football 20 minutes from my house. But there is nothing to support the idea that UNC is the "lynchpin"—whatever that means in this context—for ACC schools going to the SEC.
 
oh man you are an attorney? Shoot.. save me a seat in the suites when we play in Atlanta for the SEC championship :)
I didn't say ridiculously rich attorney. Hell, I am not spending money to come to Texas because F1 has driven prices too high.
 
False....

It wasn't just tejas/Oklahoma.

After about Week 4, TCU had Top 10 ratings against everybody they played regardless of how bad the opponent was. Because they became a potential CFP team.

But teams like TCU can only draw like that when "they become a potential CFP team". Look at what they draw when they AREN'T a potential CFP team versus a Texas or Oklahoma. What were their ratings this year?n Texas and Oklahoma draw even when they aren't in contention.
 
and thats my point. why pick Rutgers who has been making money but will never have a chance at the playoff vs Oklahoma State who has just as good a chance to make it?
why go to Rutgers to have a chance at 8 wins (their most in a season in the Big) and their 2 bowl wins out of 3 bowls since joining the Big vs Oklahoma State who in the same time frame has 5 double digit win seasons, 7 bowl wins, 2 of were NY6, would have made expanded playoff a couple times and now doesnt have Oklahoma and Texas to deal with?
You're thinking old school. The answer is
Animation Money GIF
 
There will always likely be a Big 12 team getting good ratings. TCU got good ratings in their title run.

As you stated though, "How long will it last?"

A team would have to be Big 12 cream of the crop for an extended period.

False....

It wasn't just tejas/Oklahoma.

After about Week 4, TCU had Top 10 ratings against everybody they played regardless of how bad the opponent was. Because they became a potential CFP team.


But teams like TCU can only draw like that when "they become a potential CFP team". Look at what they draw when they AREN'T a potential CFP team versus a Texas or Oklahoma. What were their ratings this year?n Texas and Oklahoma draw even when they aren't in contention.


Which is literally exactly what I alluded to in my first post.

Each year there will likely be at least one "TCU" type team in the Big 12 making a CFP run. Said team/teams will likely get good ratings for that particular year.
 
Basketball is a factor too though. There's enough decent football and good basketball programs in the Big 12 to link up with ACC schools to make a solid overall conference that could be appealing to networks. It won't be the same as P2 value, but it would closer and certainly better than what they stand to make now. If they stand pat, the gap in revenue is so large they will easily be irrelevant
It is a factor but not enough to come close to making up the difference...at least from what we've seen offered in media deals. From what I understand the number of football games a conference has that can draw 4 million or more viewers is what the media is willing to pay the big bucks for. I guess they'd pay the same for basketball games that can draw 4 million viewers or more a game. But I haven't seen such. Help me out @WhosYourDawggy
 
You're thinking old school. The answer is
Animation Money GIF
money those players likely wont see. this tv money isnt going to players at schools like rutgers
 
Which is literally exactly what I alluded to in my first post.

Each year there will likely be at least one "TCU" type team in the Big 12 making a CFP run. Said team/teams will likely get good ratings for that particular year.
I agree....sort of. Things fell right for TCU. Unless something like 2022 TCU happens year in and year out, I don't see it. I think the Big 12 football will have so much parity there won't be a team run away from the others. I may be wrong.
And I just don't think the occasional "good run" will be enough to drive a media partner to up their ante. They want a multitude of conference games that are way up in the viewership scale.
 
money those players likely wont see. this tv money isnt going to players at schools like rutgers
What is Rutgers (and schools like them in the B1G/SEC) going to do with all their media money?
 
It is a factor but not enough to come close to making up the difference...at least from what we've seen offered in media deals. From what I understand the number of football games a conference has that can draw 4 million or more viewers is what the media is willing to pay the big bucks for. I guess they'd pay the same for basketball games that can draw 4 million viewers or more a game. But I haven't seen such. Help me out @WhosYourDawggy
Basketball has nothing to do with any of this. The money is driven by football.

The B12 is trying to become the basketball conference, yet the SEC has 8 teams in, the B1G has 6, the B12 8, and the ACC has 5.

I do believe the P4 takes over March Madness sooner than we think. There is a lot of money sitting there that they won't ignore forever.
 
This thing will take a year to figure which venue and two years to try the case.
I doubt it. ESPN can opt out of the deal in February. I wouldn't be surprised if ESPN made an announcement by the first game this season.
 
The true prize reportedly might be in North Carolina. See "might be"

Then, "However, the most important brand is apparently in Chapel Hill." Yet, nowhere in the article do they point out why that is the brand everyone wants when we all know this is driven by football money, something that UNC does not deliver in any way.

If you dig down into the article, he cites an article I read by Ross Dellenger. Here is what he had to say:

“North Carolina,” said an industry source, “is the lynchpin.”

About 5 paragraphs later, this is all he says:

"The Tar Heels remain the lynchpin to the ACC’s future. They are a charter member of the conference, reside in its geographic center, boast an impressive academic reputation, and are arguably the conference’s most valuable brand, from both a football and basketball perspective as well as Olympic sports."

No mention of the finances that UNC doesn't bring, although he later says, "Football-related TV distribution is the primary revenue driver for most major college athletic departments." UNC doesn't drive any revenue there.

In discussing where Clemson and FSU would land, schools that bring way more football revenue to the table, Dellenger says:

"It is unlikely that any SEC or Big Ten school will agree to accept a reduction in their TV distribution to add any school. For the SEC, that is especially so given its footprint: the league already owns a foothold in South Carolina and in Florida. Also, the SEC programs in those states would likely make a fuss, if they haven’t already, over inviting into the league their arch-rivals (See: Texas A&M’s reaction to the SEC inviting Texas).

In order for the Big Ten and SEC to expand, they’d likely need more money from their television partners — a lot more money (more than $100 million a year). That’s primarily Fox for the Big Ten and ESPN for the SEC. There is one problem with this.

There isn’t as much money in the market as there once was,” said a conference official with knowledge of the networks’ dealings."


Basically, he is acknowledging that football revenue drives the decisions. No SEC or B1G team is going to take a cut. The team coming in has to bring in $100 million in actual value, and the TV partners aren't going to just pony that up as there isn't as much in the market as there used to be. None of that bodes well for UNC to be the "lynchpin" of anything. The only thing UNC has going for it is (1) academic prestige (the SEC doesn't care), (2) Olympic sports (the SEC doesn't care), and (3) a new market that is not important now and less so in the future.

Now throw in that the NC legislature has taken the decision to move conferences out of the schools' hands and put them into the UNC System Board of Governors' hands, which means UNC is going anywhere without NC State. The SEC and the B1G don't want NCState, and there is no reason to be optimistic that UNC has a place to land.

However, in January, a new policy change in the state of North Carolina adds a wrinkle to any realignment. The UNC System Board of Governors voted to give the system president and itself final authority over a school changing conferences. The policy now requires the school chancellor to provide notice and a financial plan for a school’s potential conference exit.

The Board of Governors has authority over both North Carolina and NC State. Does this mean NC State and UNC are a package deal if they are to leave the ACC? Perhaps.

North Carolina Gov. Roy Cooper believes the two should not compete in separate conferences.

“I would hope that would not happen and that would not be good for our state,” he said earlier this year.


I have a son who graduated from UNC and one who is in medical school at UNC, and I would love to have SEC football 20 minutes from my house. But there is nothing to support the idea that UNC is the "lynchpin"—whatever that means in this context—for ACC schools going to the SEC.
I just telling you that I keep seeing UNC as a team the SEC wants and it has been that way for multiple years.

To the point I wouldn't be surprised if the SEC offered UNC before FSU or Clemson (which I don't think either really adds anything to the conference that we don't already have). As to that state law, UNC is going to have to figure that out and fast or they will get stuck in a dying ACC with no way out.

Personally, I would love to see UNC and Duke added and call it day but also understand that doesn't make the most economic sense but it would make the SEC the premier basketball league in college and make the SEC arguably the leader in almost every major college sport.

Football
Men's Basketball
Women's Basketball
Baseball
Softball

Honestly, the only big one we wouldn't be the top conference would be Women's soccer and it wouldn't take that much to grab that if it became a priority.

If the SEC just means more then let's mean it in every damn sport by God.
 
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