More Michigan Cheating

NewPhoneWhoDis said:
It is way above my pay grade. Best I can think is he could say to the DC, i think it is a pass or i think it is a run. You'd have to know the playbook of the opposing team to know exactly what plays are being called from the sideline.
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It is not necessarily the play being stolen. It could be adjustments to pass protections, shifts, motions, stunts, blitzes ...
 
Red_Alert said:
Not sure what there is not to get?

Michigan was going to get an edge over future opponents with the action. Let's do this on the down low by paying 3rd parties.

The evidence that the in person filming benefitted Michigan when playing their future opponents is overwhelming.
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Teams change their sideline signals on a game to game basis. They change the people giving the signs and they change which person is sending in the real sign and which one is fake. That is what I don't get. That is what they said he was videotaping was the sideline.

I 100% agree, the guy who was doing this is dead wrong and will likely end up fired. I agree the guy was doing this to try and gain an advantage, but my head hurts trying to figure out how this could be done. How one guy could figure out the signs being given by multiple people on the opposite sideline in real time.
 
Red_Alert said:
That the analyst was paying third parties to attend future opponents of Michigan to video said future opponents sideline signals for Michigan to use when they faced them.
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Well what's weird is @NewPhoneWhoDis was swearing up and down earlier that the documents he was holding were totally photoshopped and not even real. Odd how even their own fans aren't even on the same page about their cheating.
 
NewPhoneWhoDis said:
Here is what confuses me with it. Say the military guy picked out a sign -- those calls are coming within seconds of the ball being snapped. I know we had 3 people giving signs at the same time and we weren't anywhere near the D1 P5 level. This was before all of the technology now available, so teams are even more secretive about their hand signals, using signs, etc.

It is way above my pay grade. Best I can think is he could say to the DC, i think it is a pass or i think it is a run. You'd have to know the playbook of the opposing team to know exactly what plays are being called from the sideline.
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Not hard to also watch the formation and actual play run to figure out what the signal meant.

Those two parts can be done in the film room watching the tv recording of the game and coupled with the 'in-person' video of the 3rd party that was sent to film the future opponents sideline signals.
 
batchaps4me said:
It is not necessarily the play being stolen. It could be adjustments to pass protections, shifts, motions, stunts, blitzes ...
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Are they banking on a team not changing their signs on a game to game basis? That is what I don't get. We changed up the signs, we changed up the indicators, we changed up everything from game to game. I cannot fathom every D1 football program doesn't do this.
 
NewPhoneWhoDis said:
Teams change their sideline signals on a game to game basis. They change the people giving the signs and they change which person is sending in the real sign and which one is fake. That is what I don't get. That is what they said he was videotaping was the sideline.

I 100% agree, the guy who was doing this is dead wrong and will likely end up fired. I agree the guy was doing this to try and gain an advantage, but my head hurts trying to figure out how this could be done. How one guy could figure out the signs being given by multiple people on the opposite sideline in real time.
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And this is where it comes back around full circle. Harbaugh came out and totally denied knowing a single thing about this guy doing this stuff, yet we see him on the sidelines constantly in the OC and DC's ear their their respective units are on the field, so what is it? How could Harbaugh possibly not know anything was happening?
 
NewPhoneWhoDis said:
Here is what confuses me with it. Say the military guy picked out a sign -- those calls are coming within seconds of the ball being snapped. I know we had 3 people giving signs at the same time and we weren't anywhere near the D1 P5 level. This was before all of the technology now available, so teams are even more secretive about their hand signals, using signs, etc.

It is way above my pay grade. Best I can think is he could say to the DC, i think it is a pass or i think it is a run. You'd have to know the playbook of the opposing team to know exactly what plays are being called from the sideline.
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this is why the different views in game are so important. The idea is to break down their signs by play and attempt to do just that. I have no idea how often a team changes their signs though

get fucking headsets though
 
WhosYourDawggy said:
Good take here …

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We actually don't know if this random take is good. I very much believe it's common for teams to have annalists in this very role assisting coaches with what they think might be called. And I very much doubt those people in those roles are just doing it by memory. We have no idea what signs are on those sheets or what they actually pertain to in terms of what Michigan knew about Ohio State's signals. Claiming they were "all" seems like he's filling in information that doesn't exist, and likely isn't true.

What i do think is funny is that we're finding basically every video of this guy on the sideline, in a controversy about someone theoretically filming sidelines. The irony there is fantastic.
 
MAIZEandBLUE09 said:
There is absolutely no evidence of what you just claimed. Buying tickets for someone is not equal to "paying third parties".

Funny how this went from an "elaborate network" to "2-3 people" he bought tickets for to attend games.
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If you are 'gifting' them the tickets, that is essentially paying them. There is nothing out-of-pocket to the recipient. It's actually a monetary gain.

Do you know that their travel, accommodations, and meals, weren't also being paid?
 
MAIZEandBLUE09 said:
We actually don't know if this random take is good. I very much believe it's common for teams to have annalists in this very role assisting coaches with what they think might be called. And I very much doubt those people in those roles are just doing it by memory. We have no idea what signs are on those sheets or what they actually pertain to in terms of what Michigan knew about Ohio State's signals. Claiming they were "all" seems like he's filling in information that doesn't exist, and likely isn't true.

What i do think is funny is that we're finding basically every video of this guy on the sideline, in a controversy about someone theoretically filming sidelines. The irony there is fantastic.
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What in the hell is that
 
MAIZEandBLUE09 said:
We actually don't know if this random take is good. I very much believe it's common for teams to have annalists in this very role assisting coaches with what they think might be called. And I very much doubt those people in those roles are just doing it by memory. We have no idea what signs are on those sheets or what they actually pertain to in terms of what Michigan knew about Ohio State's signals. Claiming they were "all" seems like he's filling in information that doesn't exist, and likely isn't true.

What i do think is funny is that we're finding basically every video of this guy on the sideline, in a controversy about someone theoretically filming sidelines. The irony there is fantastic.
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It’s good.
 
WhosYourDawggy said:
Could you have quoted 3 more idiotic people?
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Cowturd is Fox Sports top sports commentator. Finebaum is one of ESPN's. My assertion that the national media is laughing at this was true. Regionally, this is kicking up flames exactly where you'd expect it to.
 
Red_Alert said:
Not hard to also watch the formation and actual play run to figure out what the signal meant.

Those two parts can be done in the film room watching the tv recording of the game and coupled with the 'in-person' video of the 3rd party that was sent to film the future opponents sideline signals.
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Again -- this could all be done without going to the game. Teams are given extensive game tape. And again, the teams have all the formations teams have run already, how many times they have run or passed from that formation and the individual plays run out of each formation, unless they hide plays until the week of a game.

That is what has me lost. It isn't one person sending in signals from the sideline. It is multiple people sending in signals. You can see that on the TV every weekend any time they pan to the sideline between plays.

If they were banking on the team not changing their signs -- I could see it being a benefit, but if they change the signs on a week to week basis -- what does the week priors signals mean in the future?
 
Red_Alert said:
If you are 'gifting' them the tickets, that is essentially paying them. There is nothing out-of-pocket to the recipient. It's actually a monetary gain.

Do you know that their travel, accommodations, and meals, weren't also being paid?
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It isn't. There is absolutely no NCAA rule that suggests people on coaching staffs can't buy tickets for people, and that is most certainly not in the NCAA definition of what a school employee is.

now if that person was on the payroll in some way, then yeah -- it becomes a violation.
 
stakesarehigh said:
this is why the different views in game are so important. The idea is to break down their signs by play and attempt to do just that. I have no idea how often a team changes their signs though

get fucking headsets though
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They won't do headsets because some schools cannot afford it. It is the same reason why you aren't supposed to do what this guy did. It isn't illegal to try and steal the signs of the opposing team. It is illegal to go to the games of future opponents, because every school can't afford to do this. It comes down to the level play aspect of the NCAA.
 
NewPhoneWhoDis said:
Teams change their sideline signals on a game to game basis. They change the people giving the signs and they change which person is sending in the real sign and which one is fake. That is what I don't get. That is what they said he was videotaping was the sideline.

I 100% agree, the guy who was doing this is dead wrong and will likely end up fired. I agree the guy was doing this to try and gain an advantage, but my head hurts trying to figure out how this could be done. How one guy could figure out the signs being given by multiple people on the opposite sideline in real time.
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If doing that is his ONLY job, then it gets a lot more believable.

As I said.... The evidence that the in person filming benefitted Michigan when playing their future opponents is overwhelming.
 
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