2022 Season Thread

wildturkey said:
Oh I know he's in. I'm just saying I wouldn't put it past NASCAR to let the others in knowing there's a solid chance Kurt can't race. They make stuff up as they go along all the time and both guys are pretty popular drivers, which is all they care about. I can easily see them letting it play out this weekend for the "who is gonna make it" drama. Then sometime next week going "Kurt's not gonna be able to race. Surprise, both guys are in!"
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See, I have a problem with this narrative. Make no mistake, I'm not a NASCAR apologist. I've no problem calling them out on BS (see: the borderline retarded decision to run these cars in a street race in Chicago. SO fkn dumb). But the narrative that they "change the rules as they go in order to appease drivers, owners, or fans just really isn't actually true. The only time NASCAR has changed the rulebook mid-season is if there is a clear and obvious safety issue. Other than that, the waiverable rules are clearly defined ahead of time. For example, when Kyle Busch missed almost the entire half of a season, but was still allowed into the playoffs and eventually won the Championship. Me personally? I thought it was hot garbage. But the drivers, owners, and quite frankly the fans knew that NASCAR possessed that power under the rules before the season ever started.

As it pertains to Busch, if you think for ONE second that if he was healthy and able to drive his car and participate in the Playoff that he would just sit idly by nice and quiet while NASCAR tells him "no Kurt, we're going to say you're still too injured to drive so we can let 'driver x' into the playoffs" you're delusional and out of your mind. Kurt would NEVER sit quietly and let that happen, it isn't in his nature. If Kurt isn't driving the car, it's because he's not healthy enough to do so. End of story.

And how many seasons did Dale Jr miss the Chase or Playoff? And he was the most golden boy of golden boys. Jeff Gordon missed at least once. Johnson. The list goes on of "golden boys" who everyone seems to think NASCAR does some dirty back door shit to "prop up" who have missed the Chase/Playoff due to lack of performance. NASCAR isn't pulling any strings, and they aren't doing backdoor sweetheart deals. The racing is what it is. I think the vast majority of fans would love to see both the 12 and the 19 in the Playoff. But one of them won't be...and if Kurt indeed ends up NOT being able to drive, it won't be some backroom conspiracy theory bullshit, it'll be because his noggin is still screwed up.

These conspiracy theories only make people sound really dumb. Don't be silly.
 
Illustrious Potentate said:
That wouldn’t surprise me at all. The playoffs will forever be a farce to me, but they need to make it top 20 instead of top 30 in points for a single win to get you in. If Cole Custer fucks around and wins at Daytona, two top 5 guys in points aren’t gonna make it
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Ty Dillon, Harrison Burton, Brad K, Justin Haley, etc.....ANY of them could fuck around and win Daytona (and honestly, read those names again....it absolutely COULD happen. Slight long shots, but only slight. Each of them can win a restrictor plate in their respective equipment). And it would be hilarious and embarrassing all at the same time. You'd HAVE to think if such a thing happens, NASCAR would have no choice but to make a rule modification for future seasons. You simply can NOT have Justin Haley in the Playoff because he won a fluke restrictor plate race and have Blaney and Truex on the outside. You can NOT have that.
 
Y.O.M. said:
Ty Dillon, Harrison Burton, Brad K, Justin Haley, etc.....ANY of them could fuck around and win Daytona (and honestly, read those names again....it absolutely COULD happen. Slight long shots, but only slight. Each of them can win a restrictor plate in their respective equipment). And it would be hilarious and embarrassing all at the same time. You'd HAVE to think if such a thing happens, NASCAR would have no choice but to make a rule modification for future seasons. You simply can NOT have Justin Haley in the Playoff because he won a fluke restrictor plate race and have Blaney and Truex on the outside. You can NOT have that.
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Simple solution is just use a season long format like literally every other racing league in the world.
 
Y.O.M. said:
Ty Dillon, Harrison Burton, Brad K, Justin Haley, etc.....ANY of them could fuck around and win Daytona (and honestly, read those names again....it absolutely COULD happen. Slight long shots, but only slight. Each of them can win a restrictor plate in their respective equipment). And it would be hilarious and embarrassing all at the same time. You'd HAVE to think if such a thing happens, NASCAR would have no choice but to make a rule modification for future seasons. You simply can NOT have Justin Haley in the Playoff because he won a fluke restrictor plate race and have Blaney and Truex on the outside. You can NOT have that.
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And I say this even though I have been an apologist for the emphasis placed on wins. It was a necessary adjustment to make...winning SHOULD be emphasized and more heavily rewarded than it was in the past. Points racing is garbage racing. But if any of these scenarios play out, then it needs to be tweaked again. Top 20, top 25, something. Anything.
 
Illustrious Potentate said:
Simple solution is just use a season long format like literally every other racing league in the world.
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No. No. No.

That format didn't actually produce better racing. The quality of racing is absolutely UP since the stages were introduced, the Playoff, and the emphasis placed on winning races. These were all good changes. Still needs some more tweaking, for sure. But season long format is booorrrrrrrrrrrring.
 
Y.O.M. said:
No. No. No.

That format didn't actually produce better racing. The quality of racing is absolutely UP since the stages were introduced, the Playoff, and the emphasis placed on winning races. These were all good changes. Still needs some more tweaking, for sure. But season long format is booorrrrrrrrrrrring.
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Stages are fine, there’s just no need for a caution to close out a stage.

The points battles might not have been epic, but the quality of the individual races were at their peak from around 1999-2004.

It’s not as exciting now because anything you do doesn’t matter because of a Mickey Mouse system that somehow says Harvick isn’t the 2020 champion.

The racing is better this year, but the drivers need more personality. I want to hear Ward Burton saying he would have shot Dale Earnhardt Jr through the windshield if he could. You just don’t get that today with all these milquetoast, unrelatable robots.
 
Fish said:
Ward's a classic.

I loved it when they asked Jeff Burton why him and Ward talked so differently, "Ward grew up in the south end of the house"
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It broke my heart when Ward was out of a ride because AOL wanted a young driver so RCR let Johnny fucking Sauter drive the 30 car
 
Illustrious Potentate said:
Stages are fine, there’s just no need for a caution to close out a stage.

The points battles might not have been epic, but the quality of the individual races were at their peak from around 1999-2004.

It’s not as exciting now because anything you do doesn’t matter because of a Mickey Mouse system that somehow says Harvick isn’t the 2020 champion.

The racing is better this year, but the drivers need more personality. I want to hear Ward Burton saying he would have shot Dale Earnhardt Jr through the windshield if he could. You just don’t get that today with all these milquetoast, unrelatable robots.
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I would compromise on the stage issue by saying that the laps under caution in between stages should NOT count.

As for drivers needing more personality....writ large i think i agree with you, but there's still a lot of personality out there. Kevin Harvick almost murdered Chase Elliott last year at Bristol. Larson and Elliott are becoming more heated. Denny seems to mostly have issues with everyone.

Those aren't a lot of examples, which is why I still mostly agree with you. These guys are most definitely nothing like the drivers in the 90's and 2000's in terms of rage, personality, and being cut throat. I want to see more of that for sure.
 
Y.O.M. said:
I would compromise on the stage issue by saying that the laps under caution in between stages should NOT count.

As for drivers needing more personality....writ large i think i agree with you, but there's still a lot of personality out there. Kevin Harvick almost murdered Chase Elliott last year at Bristol. Larson and Elliott are becoming more heated. Denny seems to mostly have issues with everyone.

Those aren't a lot of examples, which is why I still mostly agree with you. These guys are most definitely nothing like the drivers in the 90's and 2000's in terms of rage, personality, and being cut throat. I want to see more of that for sure.
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If the teams will let them be themselves, guys coming up like Ty Gibbs and Noah Gragson have a ton of personality.

NASCAR lost a lot of personality when Stewart retired, and Harvick doesn’t have many more years left in him and Kyle Busch has mellowed out a lot.

I think what hurt NASCAR the most this century was the most dominant driver of the century being about as boring as they come and the most popular driver not being near one of the best.
 
And top 5’s used to mean a lot to drivers. Now they don’t even matter. I used to be happy when Dale Earnhardt would have a good finish even if he didn’t win. You’ll never see someone get emotional over a 4th place finish again.



Also it’s completely unrealistic and smells fishy that every year of the playoffs, the Mickey Mouse champion won the championship race.
 
Illustrious Potentate said:
And top 5’s used to mean a lot to drivers. Now they don’t even matter. I used to be happy when Dale Earnhardt would have a good finish even if he didn’t win. You’ll never see someone get emotional over a 4th place finish again.



Also it’s completely unrealistic and smells fishy that every year of the playoffs, the Mickey Mouse champion won the championship race.
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I kind of have a problem with that too. Also all 4 of them always seem to be up front in that race.

How often does that happen the rest of the year?
 
Fish said:
I kind of have a problem with that too. Also all 4 of them always seem to be up front in that race.

How often does that happen the rest of the year?
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Not very. Odds should say at least one will miss the setup, or one won’t be strong at Phoenix. There’s been 8 of them now, you’d think at least one would feature the champion finishing 6th while the other 3 weren’t competitive
 
Illustrious Potentate said:
Not very. Odds should say at least one will miss the setup, or one won’t be strong at Phoenix. There’s been 8 of them now, you’d think at least one would feature the champion finishing 6th while the other 3 weren’t competitive
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Was pretty much the same at Homestead.
 
Illustrious Potentate said:
If the teams will let them be themselves, guys coming up like Ty Gibbs and Noah Gragson have a ton of personality.

NASCAR lost a lot of personality when Stewart retired, and Harvick doesn’t have many more years left in him and Kyle Busch has mellowed out a lot.

I think what hurt NASCAR the most this century was the most dominant driver of the century being about as boring as they come and the most popular driver not being near one of the best.
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Agreed. Dale Jr being mediocre was worse for NASCAR than a lot of people realize. And yeah, Johnson was mind numbingly vanilla. But...what can you do. I've said it a million times, that's why it's so important to have guys like Harvick around, and not just "around" but competitive. In the Playoff. Winning at least occasionally.
 
Y.O.M. said:
Agreed. Dale Jr being mediocre was worse for NASCAR than a lot of people realize. And yeah, Johnson was mind numbingly vanilla. But...what can you do. I've said it a million times, that's why it's so important to have guys like Harvick around, and not just "around" but competitive. In the Playoff. Winning at least occasionally.
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I wouldn’t call Jr mediocre. 26 wins was nothing to sneeze at. He was just well behind Johnson, Gordon, Harvick, Stewart, Busch, Edwards, Kenseth, etc. Never was a fan, but if his last name wasn’t Earnhardt, I think he’d be more respected for his career. A Ricky Rudd type.
 
Illustrious Potentate said:
I wouldn’t call Jr mediocre. 26 wins was nothing to sneeze at. He was just well behind Johnson, Gordon, Harvick, Stewart, Busch, Edwards, Kenseth, etc. Never was a fan, but if his last name wasn’t Earnhardt, I think he’d be more respected for his career. A Ricky Rudd type.
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Ehhh. I mean no doubt he wasn't bottom tier. And I was a big time Jr fan. I still have 8 and 88 paraphernalia around my house. But let's face it, he was pretty mediocre. He drove in some of the best equipment (if not THE best?) NASCAR had to offer, and it's my opinion that he should have had a lot more to show for it. He's expert level on superspeedways. No one could navigate those better than him. He was near top tier on short tracks. Average at best on 1.5 mile ovals, and dreadful on road courses. I think he kind of sniffed a championship the one season (he finished 2nd, right?) but other than that was never really in the running for a Championship at all. Arguably the most ho-hum 26 win driver. I love the guy, but...meh.
 
Y.O.M. said:
Ehhh. I mean no doubt he wasn't bottom tier. And I was a big time Jr fan. I still have 8 and 88 paraphernalia around my house. But let's face it, he was pretty mediocre. He drove in some of the best equipment (if not THE best?) NASCAR had to offer, and it's my opinion that he should have had a lot more to show for it. He's expert level on superspeedways. No one could navigate those better than him. He was near top tier on short tracks. Average at best on 1.5 mile ovals, and dreadful on road courses. I think he kind of sniffed a championship the one season (he finished 2nd, right?) but other than that was never really in the running for a Championship at all. Arguably the most ho-hum 26 win driver. I love the guy, but...meh.
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I never was a fan. I’m not one pull for someone because of who their dad is. I was an Earnhardt fan as a kid, I became a Harvick fan after Sr died.

But he wasn’t elite, but he still had a solid career. He had a better showing at Hendrick than Kasey Kahne and DEI was a shit show his last few years there. He’s not Dave’s Allison, but he’s not Larry Pearson either. He belonged and had a decent career.
 
Just an odd stay for the Earnhardts. Sr has Jr beat in every positive category except one. Jr has more career lead lap finishes. I guess that’s a product of the 80’s when it was pretty common to only have a few cars finish on the lead lap.

Hell, when Benny Parsons won his championship, he only had one win that season, and that win was his only lead lap finish that season
 
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